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Old 10-12-2005, 07:00 AM   #1
Buincchotourb

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Paul_au

I can only assume that youíre an expert on listening only. The native speaker still made grammatically errors; therefore, itís forgiven for Thai people whose English is not their first language. Iím quite certain that a lot of Thai people who read your message appreciate your remark regarding the way to improve their broken English. Bless your heart.

You mentioned that you had seen a word- police on this website, you can jump in to straight them out. That would be really kind of you.

The Philippine was once colonized by America, not to mention Spain, so they were forced to use English as their official language. Thailand, on the other hand, still has her people speaking broken English for she herself has never been forced to adopt foreign language as her official one. Simple is that.

Obviously, I have some Thai in me so that makes me Thai, too. I have a tendency of giving myself a break about English for I always have an excuse to say that I wasnít born under an influence of any nation. To have broken English is not really a big deal to me.
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Old 12-30-2005, 08:00 AM   #2
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Quote[/b] ]Now, i know i am not saying i have perfect english myself but i sure give credit to those teachers for teaching those student what they've learn. at least they are shairing their knowledge with others. geeeeeeeeeeezz you are getting on my nerves!
Don't get excited Bopha_MeanMjass, it's bad for your heart
paul_au is paul_au. We should force him to eat a dictionnary. Possible he will learn the grammar! If not it will be a mean for him stop talking!
Because if he speak as he write.... ( what he say and how he say)
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Old 02-06-2006, 08:00 AM   #3
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Paul_au,

EXCUSE ME??? i could not help myself after reading your msg here about how they( thai) have very poor english..

"I think Thailand could get an award for broken English ability, there level of English is way below countries like the Philippines which has an economy who's average per capiter income is half that of Thailand."

How could you say such thing. Now before you jump in and saying their english are bad..I suggested you read your own post again. I dont know who you are and what you are, but to me, It seems like you are bregging too much about yourself here sir!!

I know for the fact that you are not all of that Mr! just look at your post here, I found more MISTAKES on your post then anyone in this thread.

You've got very bad Grammer, your spelling is totally off. let me give you and advice, next time before you open your mouth and start criticizing how bad their english are and before you go there and correct them, i suggested you get your self a dictionary.

Now, i know i am not saying i have perfect english myself but i sure give credit to those teachers for teaching those student what they've learn. at least they are shairing their knowledge with others. geeeeeeeeeeezz you are getting on my nerves!
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Old 02-27-2006, 08:00 AM   #4
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Paul_au, I am not sure what your point is with this post: are you saying that students should learn broken English because that will prepare them better for conversations with people around the world? Or are you saying that when it comes to hiring English teachers, laypeople with "charisma" should be preferred over people with a degree who are actually qualified to be teachers?

If the latter is the case, I disagree with you. While it certainly makes learning easier if a teacher has the ability to motivate students (if that's what you mean by "charisma"), this ability alone is not sufficient enough for serious English education. I have had my share of such teachers over the last few years: they were connecting with the classroom, they made than one hour fun, sure! However, the class time we spent with these folks was not productive. We didn't learn anything. Whether it was because they didn't know how to convey their knowledge effectively, or because their knowledge was meager to begin with, I am not sure. Either way, I feel that most such people use their "charismatic" skills just to hide their inabilities in other aspects of teaching. If I want to see actors, I go to the theater. If I want to be amused by clowns, I go to the circus. However, when I want to learn something as complex as a language, I prefer qualified teachers with a degree - not because of the piece of paper, but because it is an indication of their commitment, and because they might actually know what they are doing.

Don't get me wrong, it is great if teachers are able to reach the class beyond the dry lectures of a textbook. But it is only the icing on the cake. Charismatic people with proper education is the ideal combination.
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Old 03-18-2006, 08:00 AM   #5
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Quote[/b] ]I have absolutely no tolerance for people who are native English speakers and still butcher the language.
I agree. I don't have tolerance for that either. I am especially tough on grammar when it comes to grading. When my students are complaining, I just say "it is your mother language, you use it for more than twenty years, you should know better." That usually shuts them up. Whether the silence is an indication of shame or they are just out of arguments, I don't know.
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Old 03-24-2006, 08:00 AM   #6
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I do find Paul's logic intreresting. If I understand him correctly (and I might not since I have formal training and teach at a university), he is trying to convince us that he is qualified to teach English (broken English) as a foreign language. His rationale appears to be that, since he cannot speak English well either, he is uniquely qualified to teach the language to others who are having difficulty with pronunciation and grammar. Additional qualifications appear to be his charisma and his ability to mimic the broken English speaking patterns of non-native English speakers. How am I doing so far?
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Old 04-04-2006, 10:47 AM   #7
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I like this topic because of its humour factor and stress relieving capabilities, especially since I am in the middle of my study break in preparation for my semester end examinations. Therefore I'm going to commit myself for the next ten minutes responding to this highly hilarious topic started by His Royal Highness, Paul of Australia.

Paul:
Quote[/b] ]Now I have noticed on this web site there seems to be people who take it on them selves to be the word POLICE
I declare myself to be one of your so-labelled "word police". I just cannot tolerate native English speakers who abuse the language. It is an entirely different matter when non-native English speakers are involved, because it is not their mother tongue, they deserve some leeway. I submit that this is entirely discriminating but yet fair.

Quote[/b] ]I have had my own English corrected so many times, If some thing is spelt incorrectly, if you don't know what the word is, that just shows me that your English is so poor you cannot understand incorrect spelling.
Quote[/b] ]That makes me an expert on English, more so than some chain learnt university trained teacher from the USA or England.
You are a native English speaker and even claim to be an expert of the language surpassing degree holding language teachers from the two countries which saw the birth of American and the Queen's English respectively. Your topic starting post ought to be taken to the yard and shot if the above claims are true. As an English speaking "expert", you set a horrendous example for non-native English speakers. The irony in your posts is almost laughable. I mean it is laughable. You deserve all the criticism you receive for your abuse of the beautiful language.

Your other points, if they could even be called that, are too ridiculous to even refute. However, you again succeeded in entertaining me during a very dull moment, showing that maybe you really do have the "charisma" to be a "teacher". Thank you.

Visionchaser45
Quote[/b] ]I admire any person who speaks a language (in any way that is understood by native speakers) that is not their native language. I have absolutely no tolerance for people who are native English speakers and still butcher the language. If the person has dyslexia or some other learning disability, that is another story. Otherwise, I just assume the person is lazy and ignorant.
Agreed!

Quote[/b] ]I do find Paul's logic intreresting. If I understand him correctly (and I might not since I have formal training and teach at a university), he is trying to convince us that he is qualified to teach English (broken English) as a foreign language. His rationale appears to be that, since he cannot speak English well either, he is uniquely qualified to teach the language to others who are having difficulty with pronunciation and grammar. Additional qualifications appear to be his charisma and his ability to mimic the broken English speaking patterns of non-native English speakers. How am I doing so far?
So far so good, I think. It is amazing that you managed to read that much of his posts. I read about 38.72% (I think I inherited Paul's ability of plucking percentages from the sky) of the posts and concussed.

MrBradUSA
Quote[/b] ]Language: nothing speaks louder than words, if you know how to use them.

--Garrison Keillor and the Profession Of English Majors
According to His Majesty, Professor Keillor and the entire Profession of English Majors are not worthy of teaching the language for they lack "charisma" and the ability to fluently understand "broken" English nor speak articulately the language as spoken by "ethnic" non-native English speakers.

P.S. I spent a total of 8 minutes and 40+ seconds typing this out.

N.B. The amount of time taken stated above is not a mere collection of random digits as some would be led to believe but rather an accurate account courtesy of my trusty "non-native English speaking" Seiko clock. (This clock tells time as its first language.)
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Old 04-04-2006, 11:04 AM   #8
esconsise

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Quote[/b] ]The amount of time taken stated above is not a mere collection of random digits as some would be led to believe but rather an accurate account courtesy of my trusty "non-native English speaking" Seiko clock. (This clock tells time as its first language.)
LOL! You have a great sense of humor
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Old 04-04-2006, 11:22 AM   #9
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Quote[/b] ]LOL! You have a great sense of humor
But still, I am no match for His Majesty in the art of tickling the funny bone.
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Old 04-04-2006, 03:14 PM   #10
esconsise

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Don't you mean His Royal Hinie?
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Old 04-04-2006, 07:10 PM   #11
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Here's an obscure American Regionalism:

"Y'all Ga' bai' badai-der?"

One Beer Chang for anyone who can translate the above into Standard American or The Queens's English (Hint:Both "correct" versions are identical)
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Old 04-05-2006, 12:35 AM   #12
esconsise

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Quote[/b] ]"Y'all Ga' bai' badai-der?"
Wow, that's a new one on me! I have been to almost all of the lower 48 states and have never heard this phrase. Is it Louisiana Cajun perhaps? The "Y'all" at least places it in the southeastern United States, right?
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Old 04-05-2006, 02:19 AM   #13
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Quote[/b] ]Here's an obscure American Regionalism:

"Y'all Ga' bai' badai-der?"
That is an American Indian on moonshine from Texas, imitating the out back English language accent of the Australian Aboriginal.
What he is saying
"Have a drink Mate"
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Old 04-05-2006, 03:34 AM   #14
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I'm so disillusioned by the results of Thai non-native English teachers. The result is the child knows grammar well, the child may know how to spell half OK, But in reality if I was to take that child to say Germany, which is a country that speaks English as a second language very well, the English speaking population of that country would Just not be able to understand the child's diction, his pronunciation, his accent, My point is that what's the need for good grammar if only a native English speaker from a multi-ethnic city will understand your diction.
I realize most westerns use bad grammar when they talk, even if they know the correct grammar. They chose not to use good grammar as they know the other person can interpret what they mean. Westerners have a tendency to improve there grammar when talking to none native English speakers so they can be understood.
A typical western saying in Australia "I didn't do nothing" saying a double negative means you actually did some thing, but any native speaker would tell you this means you did nothing.
I think unqualified native teacher would teach good grammar, but they would also be more qualified to teach the language of the street, and how to pronounce the English language better than a non-native English university graduated teacher.
If I was to teach English, I don't think I would teach English grammar as well as a university graduate, and my student may not even pass an English language exam with as high a mark. but I can guarantee one thing, the people of Germany who speak English as a second language would have no trouble understanding him or her. If I took this student to Australia, they would not notice a very strong accent, and the Australian would understand them more easily then some migrant that use good grammar but have poor diction.
Australian's do not like very good grammar being used in the street, adequate grammar is good enough, very good grammar is considered snobbery and Australia has not got a big class structure, You only have to listen to Australia's richesh man Kerry Packer, he has 6 billion dollars, and he talks the same as me or any average australian.
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Old 04-05-2006, 05:23 AM   #15
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Quote[/b] ]but he is serious Makiy0
That's exactly what makes him so funny.
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Old 05-07-2006, 07:00 AM   #16
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I just heard this on the radio this morning:

Language: nothing speaks louder than words, if you know how to use them.

--Garrison Keillor and the Profession Of English Majors

Somehow I thought that was a line meant for this topic.

Brad.
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Old 05-28-2006, 07:00 AM   #17
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Quote[/b] ]Now when I was in Thailand This March I realized the Thai people's English is to be quite honest very poor compared with my recent visit to that other none English country Sweden.
Countries from northern Europe have more facilities to speak English because they take part from Anglo saxon ethnic language group. As French have facilities to speak Italian, portuguese and spanish because they take part of the latin ethnic language group .
If you have different basis language, it's understanding you have more difficulties to learn this language.
A language is in relation with cultural habits, different pronunciation, sounds difficult to pronunce if you are not native from this ethnic language group.
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Old 05-29-2006, 07:00 AM   #18
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Default Broken English
Broken English
Now I have noticed on this web site there seems to be people who take it on them selves to be the word POLICE, I have had my own English corrected so many times, If some thing is spelt incorrectly, if you don't know what the word is, that just shows me that your English is so poor you cannot understand incorrect spelling.
In Sydney Australia I have to understand herds of different migrants and there English problems, I have to decipher, there bad grammar, there poor pronunciation and there bad spelling. That makes me an expert on English, more so than some chain learnt university trained teacher from the USA or England. So for this reason next time I go to Thailand, If excepted I will be going back to school in Paknam Samut Prakan, to give an English language lesion on how to decipher Broken English, as I can impersonating people from every ethnic group,, When you travel the world, your not going to here articulated English speech like you see on TV from native English speakers, like my self, what your going to here is broken English And that in Australia is English from people who are not from your country and which English is not there first language.
Now when I was in Thailand This March I realized the Thai people's English is to be quite honest very poor compared with my recent visit to that other none English country Sweden.
To me I see all these Thai schools giving paid jobs to some English native speaker with a university degree, who very well may have no charisma to inspire kids into learning, But I guarantee some one with charisma with no degree in English like Actor Steve Erwin the Crocodile hunter could inspirer more English language skills in one day then some graduate could in one month. I think the selection criteria for teachers in Thailand is to much academic and not enough practical, you should get out of the class room and get onto the street.
I think Thailand could get an award for broken English ability, there level of English is way below countries like the Philippines which has an economy who's average per capiter income is half that of Thailand.
Personally I don't have the time to teach Thai people English more for any more than a week and it would not be financially worth my time even if I did have a degree, But I think the Thai people should look at Paying more charismatic native speaker, to get a better class of English teacher, and to stop procrastinating on if they have a degree or not, that way more schools would have teachers. It would have to be better than using some of there own paid none native English teachers as some of there broken English is so bad, if I did not have broken English skills I would not understand them, just to think these teachers are teaching, Thai students to speak a Thai form of broken English, and the Thai government is willing to waist money on these people just because they have a degree,
Thailand wake up Just use charismatic native speaker and don't waist your time on some home grown teacher that cannot speak English, just because they have a degree. The degree is secondary in importance and your not going to get native speaking volunteers in every school if your not going to pay them, not every school has a world famous web site to attract teachers for free.


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Old 08-03-2006, 07:00 AM   #19
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I agree with vc45 and I would add that a native speaker who butchers their own language throws up a red flag to me in that it hints strongly that they do not pay close attention to details in other aspects of their life. Conversely, a foreigner who masters English, as an example, indicates to me that they have far more on the ball in their life than their ability to articulate the language. Examples of such people can be found right here on this forum (you know who you are).
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Old 08-07-2006, 07:00 AM   #20
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Quote[/b] ]since he cannot speak English well either, he is uniquely qualified to teach the language to others who are having difficulty with pronunciation and grammar.
LOL!!! Let the blind lead the ones who cannot see.
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