[iiilizium]

So, is it worth it? Ford Escort 2.0L SOHC originally with 110/125 for power. Has 160,000 miles on it and I am just trying to keep it going.

Gets anywhere from 28mpg to 34mpg on average. Usually 30 though. Will new injectors help with economy and give any noticeable power increase? They are a bit pricey and I still have other things to do. (brakes, headlights and intake)
The fuel injectors would be hooked up to a cold air intake as well. The stock filters are EXPENSIVE. 4 filter replacements pays for a cold air intake kit with a filter that I can clean.

[iiilizium]

Also, what about a water thermostat?

It seems that the current one doesn't read properly. Someone told me that a new one would slightly increase economy.

I thought that it was BS, but then got to thinking. If the computer thinks that the engine is still cold or not as warm as it should be, it could be injecting slightly more fuel to try and warm the engine up.

[attractiveweb]

new injectors should only be done if you suspect something is wrong with your current ones. Flowing a little extra fuel in an n/a car is good and can supply a little more power, but the amount of fuel you would gain from new injectors would probably both decrease economy and decrease power (too much fuel is a bad thing). most stock injectors are capable of handling a lot more fuel flow than they provide. if you really want to try and give it a little more fuel, just to see what happens get a new fuel pressure regulator that runs .5 bars higher than the one you have (they usually increase .5 bar at a time). going up .5 bar would give you roughly a 10-15% increase in fuel getting to your injectors across the board at the same rpm. Of course you would want to research this for your own car prior to doing it, but fuel pressure regulators are generally cheap. Less than $50 for all cars I have bought them for. they take 10 minutes and a pair of pliers to install on most cars, and if you dont like the results you have the original to put back in, then sell the used one on ebay. Injectors are expensive and generally shouldnt be needed on any car until forced induction is introduced, even then they can be overkill unless your going over 10psi.

On my 1.8t jetta I am running 20 pounds of boost on stock injectors, with new fuel pressure regulator that is 1 bar over stock. I have software to monitor my air to fuel among other things and have found with that I have to decrease my fuel 8% to run between 2 and 5% rich with the stock injectors and i have never had it run lean unless i screwed around with the software too much.

As for the thermostat, what the person you were talking to was probably saying was to get a thermostat that opens at a lower temp than the stock one. This is an old trick on older cars that did often provide a noticable gain in power, but on most modern cars it just make the ecu go crazy when the thermostat opens too soon. If you think something is wrong with the one you have, there is an easy way to check it. get in your car and crank the heat to high. If you get heat your thermostat is pretty much for sure good. another way to tell if one is bad is when your temp gauge never goes up. but that is when they are pretty much gone.

[Cerilopasei]

Not really, for his application new fuel injectors will only increase performance IF the original injectors are have a poor spray pattern, or clogged/dirty and the injector is not metering fuel correctly. In most cases its possible to simply send them out for servicing and you'll get the original injectors back but running as they did on day 1.

Upgrading fuel injectors should only be done when the current injectors can't meet the fuel demands of the engine, this is usually determined by general HP level (as a guideline), or by watching the ECM readouts and noting when the injectors reach 100% duty cycle. 100% duty cycle is bad, that means that the injector is open 100% of the time and simply cannot provide any more fuel. If the engine needs more than the injectors provide at 100% duty then the engine will go lean, and thats bad.

For a stock application OEM injectors or serviced injectors are fine.

A thermostat will only increase economy by allowing the engine to maintain proper operating temp. A t-stat thats too cold will reduce fuel economy, and one that is too hot will cause extra wear and tear, its best to match to the season. For racing, keeping the engine cooler is better as it prevents detonation and allows for more timing. But its bad in winter because the engine will never quit heat up.

[Mymnnarry]

Couldn't hurt to refresh them IMO. I just did the o-rings, spacers and caps, and a good cleaning on my injectors for $12 dollars in parts and a couple of hours of time. Easily worth it for me to make sure they are running at peak and don't have to worry about getting clogged, going lean and blowing a head gasket.

[iiilizium]

I wouldn't be getting better or larger injectors. I would just be getting stock injectors.

I didn't know that you could get these things cleaned. I might do that. Any mechanic shop can do this? Nice and cheap! Where did you get yours done mzman?


I am just thinking, with 160,000 miles on them, even with injector cleaner and Top Tier gasoline being used often, that it wouldn't be able to clean off what 160,000 miles has done to them.

I have also been putting off the fuel filter change, but just looking at it looks like a HUGE chore. They put it in the worst place possible. Behind the engine underneath all the vacuum hoses. [thumbdown]



I just want to get all the maintenance done to this baby. It is the main source of transportation, gets great economy and I have a kid on the way so it needs to last.

Already got the transmission fluid changed, and going to do the brakes in the morning provided it isn't too cold.
Also need to tighten down the valve cover on my truck and check my vacuum lines. I think that I have leak or even a clog somewhere.


Once I get these done, and a few things paid off, I can dump $1grand into my Datsun and get it running.

[Mymnnarry]

I didn't know that you could get these things cleaned. I might do that. Any mechanic shop can do this? Nice and cheap! Where did you get yours done mzman?

I did it myself, got some injector seal kits from the local auto parts store, they were somewhere around $2.50 an injector, then cleaned the injectors inside and out and then put the new o-rings, spacers and hats, make sure to lube the rings with atf fluid so they don't rip when putting them back in the rail.

[Arximedus]

Yup, be stupid to replace them, especially with 'performance' ones unless you've already done a heap of work on it.
Check out a few places for getting the unltra-sonically cleaned with new filters and seals - I've seen places that will do them for less than it would cost me for parts - I'm not sure if I'd trust a 'corner mechanic' but there should be a few reputable FI specialists in your town.
Fuel filters really should be replaced regularely and, TBH, most aftermarket filter setups ain't worth it - make sure you know what you're getting. As you've a relatively common car, there's a good chance that you can find a cleanable replacement filter for it.
For economy, you generally want an engine that's running hot - cold for power.

TBH, a good service and attention to your driving style can be worth a darn sight more than fancy gadgets.

[DJkillos]

I didn't know that you could get these things cleaned. I might do that. Any mechanic shop can do this? Nice and cheap! Where did you get yours done mzman?

Go pick up a bottle of Seafoam from your auto parts store. Great stuff for cleaning injectors without damaging seals and such.

I generally poor in a bottle of sea foam in my car every 10k miles or so. But if you have never used it, you will probably see a lot of smoke out your exhaust for a few hours as it cleans out your injectors and other parts.

[Ruiptuptubre]

If the injectors are dirty, let them have cleaned by ultra sound...Additives for cleaning engine/injectors is a preventive and not a solution.

Thus clean it and than use some additives every few thousend miles, so the low carbon residue can be cleaned away..


Low temps of engine and/or long time to get her warm is indeed most likely the thermostat. Replacing it together with the koolant will decrease fuel consumption by a bit, but is also very important for your comfort in colder times.

-edit- That seafoam stuff, does it also let water that's in the fuel tank stick to the fuel and thus be removed? I heard of a brand that is for ship/boat diesel engines that works that way and is also good for car engines ( diesel ). -edit.

[Mymnnarry]

Go pick up a bottle of Seafoam from your auto parts store. Great stuff for cleaning injectors without damaging seals and such.

I generally poor in a bottle of sea foam in my car every 10k miles or so. But if you have never used it, you will probably see a lot of smoke out your exhaust for a few hours as it cleans out your injectors and other parts.

Seafoam is some good stuff too, might want to check that out too if you feel like being lazy and not cleaning by hand, I would do seafoam then remove and replace seals orings and hats on the injector. But I am very picky about my fuel injection system so it might be overkill.

-edit- That seafoam stuff, does it also let water that's in the fuel tank stick to the fuel and thus be removed? I heard of a brand that is for ship/boat diesel engines that works that way and is also good for car engines ( diesel ). -edit.

And yes the seafoam removes water and other fuel addatives from the tank.

[DJkillos]

-edit- That seafoam stuff, does it also let water that's in the fuel tank stick to the fuel and thus be removed? I heard of a brand that is for ship/boat diesel engines that works that way and is also good for car engines ( diesel ). -edit.

Off of their website

• Cleans fuel injectors
• Cleans carburetor jets
• Cleans carbon
• Stabilizes fuels
• Upper cylinder lube
• Removes moisture in fuel
• De-icer
• Frees sticky lifters
• Frees sticky rings
• Removes moisture in oil
• Cleans P.C.V. systems
• Cleans catalytic converter odors
• Oxygen sensor safe

It's the only product I would ever recommend anyone use to clean their injectors because quite frankly, it works. And it doesn't damage seals and o-rings like other stuff can.

[iiilizium]

I totally forgot about Seafoam. My cousin in law used it on his Mustang and tons of crap blew out onto his driveway.


I think that when the next oil change comes in my S10 and the Escort, I will just buy a bottle of this as well and do a lazy mans cleaning job.

[affozyBoomi]

be sure to tell your ECU that you've changed em.

personally I think your wasting your money on a 160,000 mile engine

[Cerilopasei]

be sure to tell your ECU that you've changed em.

personally I think your wasting your money on a 160,000 mile engine

160,000 miles is nothing. Engines should last 200,000 or more. If it doesn't, then you aren't getting your money's worth. All of my cars (cept the GTA) have rotted around the drive train till the point where I got rid of the car because the body was shot.

The GTA came without an engine or trans.

[iiilizium]

I agree. 160,000 miles is nothing with an engine and drive system that is properly taken care of.

The thing runs perfectly right now and runs great. It isn't like I am putting in $500 for a new cam. All I am doing is normal maintenance that most likely hasn't been done since day 1. I just removed the fuel filter and it is the original fuel filter!
My truck has 225,000 miles on it, still running strong, and am taking care of that the best that I can. Rather put money into it then to wait for it to die.
After my first year of owning it, I went back to emissions and I have got my engine to be a cleaner burning engine then the first time that it went to emissions.

Just wanting to do things to make the car run even better and hopefully last even longer.

Transmission change was $20.
Fuel Filter was $4
Seafoam is $8
Cold Air Intake is $50 (stock filter is $12)


I could easily get my money back in oil changes and fuel consumption. Plus things should run smoother for a little longer which beats having to get a new vehicle. And really, that list isn't nothing in terms of money spent on a car when say you have to get a new one, or the transmission blows.



Heck, when I first got the car the oil only lasted slightly less then 3,000 miles. Using the same oil, (the good stuff), the oil now lasts to and sometimes over 5,000 miles depending on how many are hwy miles. It is pretty sweet. Spend slightly more on better oil, but get more back in terms of miles and having a cleaner engine.




On my truck, I actually think that my door is going to end up rotting off before the engine dies.

[Ruiptuptubre]

337.500 KM here on the counter... Gears and engine are fine as can be.

The way it has and will be going 450.000 shouldn't be any pain.


a 500 buck repair job aren't the costs, driving a car is though.

[affozyBoomi]

160,000 miles is nothing. Engines should last 200,000 or more. If it doesn't, then you aren't getting your money's worth. All of my cars (cept the GTA) have rotted around the drive train till the point where I got rid of the car because the body was shot.

The GTA came without an engine or trans.

I still personally think hes wasting his time changing the injectors[yes]

[DJkillos]

be sure to tell your ECU that you've changed em.

Shouldn't need to as long as the flow rates are the same. And if he's going with stock injectors, he definitely doesn't need to. Though an ECU reset might help.

[DJkillos]

Heck, when I first got the car the oil only lasted slightly less then 3,000 miles. Using the same oil, (the good stuff), the oil now lasts to and sometimes over 5,000 miles depending on how many are hwy miles. It is pretty sweet. Spend slightly more on better oil, but get more back in terms of miles and having a cleaner engine.

I'm using Royal Purple in my engine now and generally don't change the oil for 6-7000 miles.

That's another product I recommend. If you really want to take care of your car and get long life, use Royal Purple.

Check out these tests and see how much better Royal Purple performs.
http://www.animegame.com/cars/Oil%20Tests.pdf

And the stuff was only about $0.20 more then Mobile 1 per quart.