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Old 07-17-2010, 11:40 AM   #1
broksaksaak

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Default Wrongs From The “Right” Bukhari - By Dr. Shabbir Ahmed
Al Salamu Aleykum,

Many if not all of you have heard of this article by the Kaffir Hadith rejector who goes by the Name "Dr. Shabbir Ahmed", I want to ask is there any refutation to this article? Not a refutation to Quranists in general but a refutation to This specific Article and all the Shubuhat inside it? If not Should we post it here and start to refute this article and taking it apart bit by bit? I want to know the Mods opinions on this as well.

Salam to All,
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Old 07-17-2010, 12:02 PM   #2
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I will look for that article, but here is some info about Shabir Ahmed which I had not known before..

Conversation with Dr. Shabbir Ahmad, translator of Holy Quran

By Rashid Jahangiri.

In April 2009 I talked on telephone with Dr. Shabbir Ahmad sahib. We talked about 20 minutes. I thanked him for publishing a rational and modern translation and interpretation of Holy Quran. I specifically informed him that when I present his translation of Holy Quran to fellow Muslims, I don’t get accused of presenting Lahori-Ahmadiyya translation. And how this has made my life easy.

Dr. Shabbir sahib informed me, he has mashAllah converted over 16000 (sixteen thousand) non-Muslims, including couple of members of JihadWatch. I purchased his translation of Holy Quran and couple of other books.

Dr. Shabbir sahib was highly respectful of late Abdul Mannan Omar sahib, Khawaja Kamal Ud Din sahib, and Maulana Muhammad Ali sahib. He was highly appreciative of their works on Holy Quran and Islam. Dr. Shabbir also informed me that he talked to Mannan sahib few years ago.

I asked Dr. Shabbir sahib, in life we see a healthy tree of sweet mangos, which is capable of producing sweet mangos, but its fruit can get infected by insects and is totally wasted. As we see in case of prophet Noah’s son. But it is not possible for a sweet mango to grow on a tree, which produces some other kind of bitter fruit. So, keeping this reasoning, how is it possible that people like Mannan sahib, Kamal ud Din sahib, and Muhammad Ali sahib, towards whom you showed so much respect because of their works on Islam and knew religion so well, they not only get attracted to, rather become staunch followers of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad sahib of Qadian? Dr. Shabir sahib was quiet and did not answer.

We talked about 1974, 2nd constitutional amendment that declared Ahmadis (both Lahori and Qadiani) a non-Muslim. Dr. shabbir sahib was of opinion that there was no need of this amendment, because it was Mirza Ghulam Ahmad sahib who “first” declared Muslims as kafir so per hadith ‘fatwah takfir’ fell back on him. I informed him that in reality it was about 200 Muslim Ulama in India who issued a joint fatwah declaring Mirza Ghulam Ahmad sahib a kafir. And Mirza sahib only applied hadith to point out to these opponent ulama that per hadith ‘fatwah takfir’ falls back on them and they subsequently become kafir. Dr. Shabbir sahib was quiet, and did not comment.

Dr. Shabbir sahib brought Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad sahib writings into question.
I replied Mirza sahib had five kinds of audiences, i.e. Muslims, Christians, Hindus, Sufia, and Atheists. So if we keep in our minds to what kind of audiences Mirza sahib is addressing, we are better able to understand him. Unfortunately, Muslim readers do not pay attention, while reading his books i.e. to which he is addressing and that’s were confusion originates. I gave him few examples.

I brought to Dr. Shabbir sahib attention that we see good percentage of Muslims, especially those living in Europe and Americas, are practically following Mirza sahib even if verbally they use abusive words for him. I told him, in my opinion, following 6 were Mirza sahib’s mission:
1- All reciters of Kalama-Shahada are Muslims.
2- No part of Holy Quran, not even a dot, is abrogated.
3- Allah SWT is living God. He has communicated with his chosen ones even after Rasul Allah SAWS. And this will continue.
4- Islam does not allow jihad with sword for its propagation.
5- Isa A.S. is physically dead. And will not return to earth.
6- Yajooj-Majooj and Dajjal is not supernatural animal.
Dr. Shabbir sahib did not object to any of above 6 points.

Dr. Shabir Ahmad wrote ‘Hashish From Qadian’. Dr Zahid Aziz sahib has written an article referring to this book, in ‘The Light—UK edition, May 2009’. See link here.

Based on my conversation with Dr. Shabbir sahib, I very much doubt if he has read Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad sahib’s books. And even if he did, he did not read them carefully. And it is very likely his opinion of Hazrat Mirza sahib is based on his teacher’s opinion. I don’t know, as Shabbir sahib never mentioned to me, but this is what I have heard that he is student of Ghulam Ahmad Pervaiz sahib. And it is known fact that Pervaiz sahib was opponent of Mirza sahib and he has used strong language for him.

I will email this blog post to Dr. Shabbir Ahmad sahib. I would like to read his comments.

Link to Dr Shabbir Ahmad’s website.
...from an Ahmedi Website (ahmadiya org) The question ofcourse is whether even this info is reliable or not

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Old 07-17-2010, 12:24 PM   #3
broksaksaak

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Wa Aleykumm el Salam,

I have his article I just didn't want to post it until I got permission.
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Old 07-17-2010, 12:37 PM   #4
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Assalamu Alaikum,

Few months before my mail Id somehow got into hands mischiveous people who used to send mail where the writers would refute Quran. In one reply I happened to see the article of Dr.Shabbir Ahmed.

They are higly mischievious. It can cause huge fitna.

I have deleted all those mail from my inbox. My opinion is avoid article of Dr.Shabbir Ahmed becuause he rejects most of the Hadith and caused fitna.

SO I would like brother TripolySunni not to post any articles of Dr.Shabbir Ahmed and would appeal to Moderators to discourage such posts.
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Old 07-17-2010, 12:44 PM   #5
broksaksaak

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Assalamu Alaikum,

Few months before my mail Id somehow got into hands mischiveous people who used to send mail where the writers would refute Quran. In one reply I happened to see the article of Dr.Shabbir Ahmed.

They are higly mischievious. It can cause huge fitna.

I have deleted all those mail from my inbox. My opinion is avoid article of Dr.Shabbir Ahmed becuause he rejects most of the Hadith and caused fitna.

SO I would like brother TripolySunni not to post any articles of Dr.Shabbir Ahmed and would appeal to Moderators to discourage such posts.
Salam, I Agree, it's a Fitnah. But how about we do jihad and reply to this thing as much as possible. I read it just now, he's an Idiot and he doesn't have any smart Arguments (in fact no arguments he's just making fun of narrations).

I mean would you guys rather hide it? or confront it head on?
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Old 07-17-2010, 12:55 PM   #6
RjkVwPcV

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Already many debate and confronation had happened in past.

These people will never listen and they will stick to their stand even if you are successfull in debating with him. They don't have the will to change their opinion. If they had will to change they would have change their path long ago.

So instead debating and confronting Dr.Shabbir Ahmed you can concentrate on other useful activity.
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Old 07-17-2010, 01:02 PM   #7
broksaksaak

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Already many debate and confronation had happened in past.

These people will never listen and they will stick to their stand even if you are successfull in debating with him. They don't have the will to change their opinion. If they had will to change they would have change their path long ago.

So instead debating and conftonting Dr.Shabbir Ahmed you can concentrate on other useful activity.
I don't wanna debate him but Why Not defend the Sunnah? and trust me it won't look too scary if we post his Shubuhat One by one and reply to each instead of Pasting the entire article. cuz when the entire thing is presented usually the ppl are overwhelmed by it's size.
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Old 07-17-2010, 01:17 PM   #8
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Consult with moderators and do accordingly
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Old 07-18-2010, 09:49 AM   #9
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Here goes:

Mahmood bin Rabe’ narrates, “I still remember when I was five years old. The Prophet (S) rinsed his mouth and then poured the water into mine.” [Vol 1 Kitabul ‘Ilm Pg 130, Hadith #77]. Could the exalted Prophet hold any human being at that level of contempt?
I say: Can a Muslim suspect the Prophet of contempt? Rather, how about we consider the barakah of our beloved Rasul , and realize that this was an honor that we should wish to have been blessed with, not consider an act of contempt. Moreover, this isn't even a proper translation! Let's consider a proper translation done by a Muslim:

Volume 1, Book 3, Number 77:

Narrated Mahmud bin Rabi'a:

When I was a boy of five, I remember, the Prophet took water from a bucket (used far getting water out of a well) with his mouth and threw it on my face.

Vol 1 Kitabul ‘Ilm Pg 136-137 Ahadith 91, 92, 93 describe such lies: The Prophet’s cheeks glowed and his face became red with anger . . . and so on. These statements are absolutely at variance with the Prophet’s character, and it appears they were fabricated to defame him. This is only one of the hundreds of such narratives that portray him to be a man of temper. The Prophet (S), in fact, was a cool-minded person with exceptional self-control. The Quran states this:

3:159 It is God's mercy that you (O Messenger) are lenient and compassionate with people. For, if you were harsh and stern of heart, they would have broken away from you.
Is this a joke? Rasulullah was a human, and, while the best of humans, it is a trait of humans to get angry. Rather, Rasulullah never got angry except when it was proper to do so.

This article is plain stupidity. I don't think there's even a need to bother with the rest of it.
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Old 07-18-2010, 09:57 AM   #10
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Just to add, I think he just made these up:

Then (elsewhere, the most beautiful) Jaunia was brought in to a garden. The Prophet told his companions to wait outside and he entered a house made of date trees. Upon entering, he said to Jaunia, “Give yourself to me.” She said, “Can a queen give herself to a thief? I seek refuge with Allah against you.” [Vol 3 Kitabut Talaq Pg 115 #238].

The Prophet married Umaima bint Sharaheel. But when he went to her and extended his hand to her, she hated it. [Reference same]
I've never even heard of a person named "Umaima bint Sharaheel," and this certainly doesn't even sound like an Arabic name.
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Old 07-18-2010, 11:30 AM   #11
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Here goes:



I say: Can a Muslim suspect the Prophet of contempt? Rather, how about we consider the barakah of our beloved Rasul , and realize that this was an honor that we should wish to have been blessed with, not consider an act of contempt. Moreover, this isn't even a proper translation! Let's consider a proper translation done by a Muslim:

Volume 1, Book 3, Number 77:

Narrated Mahmud bin Rabi'a:

When I was a boy of five, I remember, the Prophet took water from a bucket (used far getting water out of a well) with his mouth and threw it on my face.



Is this a joke? Rasulullah was a human, and, while the best of humans, it is a trait of humans to get angry. Rather, Rasulullah never got angry except when it was proper to do so.

This article is plain stupidity. I don't think there's even a need to bother with the rest of it.
The Narration above is said to be done because he is very playful with the children of the companions which is why they like him and always follow him around...(It being a blessing is one explanation)

I Know bro I read the whole thing yesterday the guy is a complete Moron, Do you know where all the answers are? It's all In Ibn Hajar's commentary called fathul Bari fi sharh Sahih al bukhari, problem is it's too hard to translate to english and even i don't understand some of his advanced Arabic but it has the answers to all of these.

for example this one:


"The Prophet disapproved of his companion Jabir’s plan to marry a widow and asked, "Why did you not marry a virgin so that you played with her and she played with you?" [Same Volume, same page]. The Prophet (S) was extremely compassionate to widows and divorced women."

Check the Correct Hadith:

Volume 7, Book 62, Number 16:
Narrated Jabir bin Abdullah:
While we were returning from a Ghazwa (Holy Battle) with the Prophet, I started driving my camel fast, as it was a lazy camel A rider came behind me and pricked my camel with a spear he had with him, and then my camel started running as fast as the best camel you may see. Behold! The rider was the Prophet himself. He said, 'What makes you in such a hurry?" I replied, I am newly married " He said, "Did you marry a virgin or a matron? I replied, "A matron." He said, "Why didn't you marry a young girl so that you may play with her and she with you?" When we were about to enter (Medina), the Prophet said, "Wait so that you may enter (Medina) at night so that the lady of unkempt hair may comb her hair and the one whose husband has been absent may shave her pubic region.

I read in fath al Bari fi sharh Sahih al bukhari, First of all the Prophet PBUH didn't disapprove nor did he break the marriage, Nor did he say anything against Widows, he didn't even go near there. He just asked the Man a question about Why he married a Matron, And asked why not a virgin. he says Why didn't you marry a young girl so that she can play with you and you can play with her (in another weaker narration there is this addition) And So she might Laugh with you and you Laugh with her ( of course he means playfully)... In Other slightly weaker narrations (which are not in bukhari) The Man says That he has (I think seven or nine ) Sisters who are all virgins after his father died and he doesn't want to marry another like them, he wants a mature woman to take care of all of them and to "Direct them" in the Home, The Prophet PBUH replies In One Narration "Jazakalahu Khayran" and in another "That's Good".

So Do you see the difference, The guy is an imbecile Haha...
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Old 08-14-2011, 01:43 PM   #12
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Brother's I am quite surprised that you'll are even considering things that are going against the holy Qur'aan and also blaspheming against the holy Prophet (PBUH). Why? And why hadith, only because it goes against the teaching of the Qur'aan. Keep up the good work! May All'aah guide all who want to be guided, the rest can split themselves into groups and keep quarelling. Signs that there is absoloutely no desire for the truth.
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Old 08-14-2011, 03:09 PM   #13
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A book by Dr Shabbir Ahmed with the title A Faith for All Seasons was praised by an Indian lawyer and intellectual A.G.Noorani (he is left oriented) for a fresh approach to Islam in his book called Islam and Jihad. So I issued the book A Faith for All Seasons and did not find it at all inspiring. He is getting entangled in his own confusions. I gave the book to a teacher of mine for browsing through. Few days later he told me that this person (Dr Shabbir Ahmed) has not made up his mind (about Islam and perhaps anything else). I personally feel that it is very unlikely that philosophy oriented people will come up with much useful insight. So that is Dr Shabbir Ahmed for me. Our refutation energies should be proportional to the impact of the fitna mongers. I'll classify him in low impact people but I stand corrected by knowledgeable people.
Wassalam
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Old 05-23-2020, 08:58 AM   #14
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Many of the people are confused about the many things which are denied by the other who will never accept Islam. SO the one and only best essay services reviews is to just make your search more strong then try to live happy life.
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