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Old 07-26-2011, 01:31 AM   #1
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Default Proof Sunni Is Right?
Salam Alkome brothers and sisters,

I would like to ask a simple question. Does anyone have proof that the sunnah school of thought, is right?
I would like to debate the truth, and why we need to stop denying the prophets blood line as the true leader (Imam Ali) After the prophet's (Pbuh) death.

If anyone here can prove to me that sunnah is right, i will convert, but inturn if i prove that Imam ali is the right calpih, or any other claim anyone has against, the (shia school of thought), you must revert and become a True Muslim.

Femalah, "An idle mind is the devil's workshop".
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Old 07-26-2011, 01:36 AM   #2
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the prophets blood line as the true leader (Imam Ali) After the prophet's (Pbuh) death.
after the death of prophet the leader of Mumin was Abu bakr(rd), then Umar(rd), then Usman(rd), then Ali(rd).
but inturn if i prove that Imam ali is the right calpih,
He was right, and he followed other right caliph´s before him.
the (shia school of thought)
it didnt exist at the time of prophet neither at time of ali(rd).
If anyone here can prove to me that sunnah is right,
well sunnah means method of prophet , and muslim follows the method of prophet
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Old 07-26-2011, 01:40 AM   #3
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Yes, shia didnt exist, and sunni didnt ethier. Only islam, and muslims existed. As for ali being the 4th, this is where shia sunni debate. Am debating him being first.

033.006
YUSUFALI: The Prophet is closer to the Believers than their own selves, and his wives are their mothers. Blood-relations among each other have closer personal ties, in the Decree of Allah. Than (the Brotherhood of) Believers and Muhajirs: nevertheless do ye what is just to your closest friends: such is the writing in the Decree (of Allah).

PICKTHAL: The Prophet is closer to the believers than their selves, and his wives are their mothers. And the owners of kinship are closer one to another in the ordinance of Allah than (other) believers and the fugitives (who fled from Mecca), except that ye should do kindness to your friends. This is written in the Book (of nature).

SHAKIR: The Prophet has a greater claim on the faithful than they have on themselves, and his wives are their mothers; and the POSSESSORS OF RELATIONSHIPS HAVE THE BETTER CLAIM IN THE ORDINANCE OF Allah TO INHERITANCE, one with respect to another, than (other) believers, and (than) those who have fled (their homes), except that you do some good to your friends; this is written in the Book.
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Old 07-26-2011, 01:42 AM   #4
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Yes, shia didnt exist, and sunni didnt ethier.
True, if some people wouldnt leave islam and become shia and play with the name of Islam, Sunnis wouldnt have exist.
As for ali being the 4th, this is where shia sunni debate. Am debating him being first.
ali(rd) didnt do it, why you are doing it? are you better than ali(rd)?
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Old 07-26-2011, 01:48 AM   #5
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The Prophet SAWS said: “The Israelis used to be ruled and guided by prophets: Whenever a prophet died, another would take over his place. There will be no prophet after me, but there will be Caliphs who will increase in number.” The people asked, “O Allah’s Apostle! What do you order us (to do)?” He said, “Obey the one who will be given the pledge of allegiance first. Fulfil their (i.e. the Caliphs) rights, for Allah will ask them about (any shortcoming) in ruling those Allah has put under their guardianship.”
[Sahih al-Bukhari]

Debate over.
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Old 07-26-2011, 01:50 AM   #6
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Debate over.
hope the real truth seeker accepts the truth now like Ali(rd).
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Old 07-26-2011, 01:50 AM   #7
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Play With the name of islam? Give me reasons why shia islam, is wrong? Also, can you debate the quran i quoted? , as for my second thing you "quoted" Am only a human being. Am not better, but i just want to create some light on the subject. How are we going to become one ummah if we fight over things when the truth is clearly in are face?
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Old 07-26-2011, 01:52 AM   #8
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Play With the name of islam? Give me reasons why shia islam, is wrong? Also, can you debate the quran i quoted? , as for my second thing you "quoted" Am only a human being. Am not better, but i just want to create some light on the subject. How are we going to become one ummah if we fight over things when the truth is clearly in are face?
That Quranic verse you quoted, Does it say "Your Leader is 'Ali" ?
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Old 07-26-2011, 01:57 AM   #9
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I was born Shia and people still know me as Shia. I like to think of myself as "MUSLIM ."

I love Imam Ali and Imam Hussein. They were raised by the prophet so to me questioning that they are good muslims and good role models is out of the question.

However I see my fellow Shia often spending so much time doing Duaa for Ahil Al Bet, who are at the end of the day humans, and that time is better spent praising Allah.

Anyway, I fail to see why ALL Shia and ALL Sunna cant get along. We agree on 99% of things, and at the end only Allah can judge who is doing the last 1% right. In fact only Allah can judge if we are doing anything right.

The only winners in the Shia-Sunni split are the enemies who are out to destory us. A tomahawk does not know Shia and Sunna thats for sure.
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Old 07-26-2011, 01:59 AM   #10
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Femalah, "An idle mind is the devil's workshop".
This will insha'Allah keep you occupied: Gift #1, Gift #2 & Gift #3. May Allah ta'ala guide you on the straight path.
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Old 07-26-2011, 02:00 AM   #11
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[Sahih al-Bukhari]

Debate over.
Oh brother, i will never quote you with a book, other than the quran! I have gave you a quran quote that shows my point. But since you brought up sahih al-Bukhari, lemme bring up some quotes from it.


(A) Abu Hurayra reported that the Prophet (may Allah bless him and grant him peace) said, 'On the Day of Judgement when Allah Most High throws the people into the hell fire, it will say, "Give me more." Then Allah Most High will create a nation and then throw them into it. The hell fire will again complain, "I want more", and again Allah Most High will create a nation and throw them into it. The hell fire will again say, "I want more" and then Allah Most High will put His feet onto the hell fire and it will be full"


A CONTRADICTION:

Narrated Abdullah:

The Prophet said, "None has the right to say that I am better than Jonah bin Matta."
Sahih Al-Bukhari, Volume 6, Book 60, Number 127

Narrated Abu Huraira:

The Prophet said, "Whoever says that I am better than Jonah bin Matta, is a liar."
Sahih Al-Bukhari, Volume 6, Book 60, Number 128

ARE WE TO BELIEVE IN FALSEHOOD?

That is like saying: "Whoever says that the TORAH is BETTER than the QURAN then he is a LIAR!

According to Quranic Tafsir's, Prophet Yunus (as) was sent by Allah to the people of Nineveh, which was a town in the area of Mawsil [in northern Iraq] ...

Can a Prophet who was sent to GUIDE a community of a particular people of a particular place of a particular time be COMPARED to the one who was SENT without any restrictions with regards to time place and matter?
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Old 07-26-2011, 02:02 AM   #12
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I was born Shia and people still know me as Shia. I like to think of myself as "MUSLIM ."

I love Imam Ali and Imam Hussein. They were raised by the prophet so to me questioning that they are good muslims and good role models is out of the question.

However I see my fellow Shia often spending so much time doing Duaa for Ahil Al Bet, who are at the end of the day humans, and that time is better spent praising Allah.

Anyway, I fail to see why ALL Shia and ALL Sunna cant get along. We agree on 99% of things, and at the end only Allah can judge who is doing the last 1% right. In fact only Allah can judge if we are doing anything right.

The only winners in the Shia-Sunni split are the enemies who are out to destory us. A tomahawk does not know Shia and Sunna thats for sure.
I will not desagree with you about the duaa, but we must look at the common ground and not the differences and unite with this. There is to much sunnis that say the prophet had no grandson etc, this is not right, there parents are teaching them nonesense.
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Old 07-26-2011, 02:05 AM   #13
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I was born Shia and people still know me as Shia. I like to think of myself as "MUSLIM ."

I love Imam Ali and Imam Hussein. They were raised by the prophet so to me questioning that they are good muslims and good role models is out of the question.

However I see my fellow Shia often spending so much time doing Duaa for Ahil Al Bet, who are at the end of the day humans, and that time is better spent praising Allah.

Anyway, I fail to see why ALL Shia and ALL Sunna cant get along. We agree on 99% of things, and at the end only Allah can judge who is doing the last 1% right. In fact only Allah can judge if we are doing anything right.

The only winners in the Shia-Sunni split are the enemies who are out to destory us. A tomahawk does not know Shia and Sunna thats for sure.
السلام عليكم

According to the Muslim scholars, those who HATE 'Ali (kw) or al-Hussein ibn 'Ali (ra) have committed a huge sin that could lead them to hellfire.

Loving them is OBLIGATORY even if you don't know anything about their lives and even if you haven't read any books.

As for the differences between the Muslims and the Twelver Shia sect there are plenty of differences, let me just give you an example:

http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/show...d-the-Prophets
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Old 07-26-2011, 02:06 AM   #14
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As i thought, i have shown proof from the quran that ali (as) is the rightful calpiha, while i only got proof from a hadiah book that has more wrong writings than right. IF you want to keep saying i was wrong go ahead. Just remember we all could die 2morrow, why not try to find truth? i searchd into sunni and found that the shia school of thought was right on more cases than sunni (There both wrong to a extent) . Thats why i call my self a muslim but i believe in the ahlulbayt. I follow the quran and the prophet muhammad (pbuh).

"And be not of those who have devided and differed among themeselves after the clear proofs had come to them. It is they for whom there is a awful torment."

"Verily, those who divide their religion and break up into sects, you (O Muhammad SAW) have no conern in them in the least. There affiars is only with allah (swt), who then will tell them what they used to do."

After the sunni/shia split you know what i found out? Each sect prays 5 times a day, they fast ramadan they give their annual charity , they travel for hajj. And they both say "there is no god but allah (swt) and Mohammaed (pbuh) IS his final messenger."

Lets realize are common ground from the differnces before its to late!
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Old 07-26-2011, 02:09 AM   #15
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There is to much sunnis that say the prophet had no grandson etc
lol

its the same way of denying history like shias deny history about ali(rd)being the 4th caliph.ring a bell?
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Old 07-26-2011, 02:11 AM   #16
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Oh brother, i will never quote you with a book, other than the quran! I have gave you a quran quote that shows my point. But since you brought up sahih al-Bukhari, lemme bring up some quotes from it.


(A) Abu Hurayra reported that the Prophet (may Allah bless him and grant him peace) said, 'On the Day of Judgement when Allah Most High throws the people into the hell fire, it will say, "Give me more." Then Allah Most High will create a nation and then throw them into it. The hell fire will again complain, "I want more", and again Allah Most High will create a nation and throw them into it. The hell fire will again say, "I want more" and then Allah Most High will put His feet onto the hell fire and it will be full"


A CONTRADICTION:

Narrated Abdullah:

The Prophet said, "None has the right to say that I am better than Jonah bin Matta."
Sahih Al-Bukhari, Volume 6, Book 60, Number 127

Narrated Abu Huraira:

The Prophet said, "Whoever says that I am better than Jonah bin Matta, is a liar."
Sahih Al-Bukhari, Volume 6, Book 60, Number 128

ARE WE TO BELIEVE IN FALSEHOOD?

That is like saying: "Whoever says that the TORAH is BETTER than the QURAN then he is a LIAR!

According to Quranic Tafsir's, Prophet Yunus (as) was sent by Allah to the people of Nineveh, which was a town in the area of Mawsil [in northern Iraq] ...

Can a Prophet who was sent to GUIDE a community of a particular people of a particular place of a particular time be COMPARED to the one who was SENT without any restrictions with regards to time place and matter?
First of all you are off-topic.

Open another thread if you want to discuss these Ahadith as they have nothing to do with the matters of Caliphate.

Secondly The Prophet SAWS doesn't want us to compare between prophets from what it seems, so maybe he doesn't want people to say This prophet is better than that prophet and so on... One narration is by 'Abdullah and another is by Abu Huraira (raa) and both have pretty much the same meaning.

As for the narration you got from Bukhari can you tell me how it is different than this Quranic verse:

[Allah] said, "O Iblees, what prevented you from prostrating to that which I created with My hands? Were you arrogant [then], or were you [already] among the haughty?" (38:75)
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Old 07-26-2011, 02:13 AM   #17
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My posts are not being accepted anymore, untill a mod approves them? This just shows that we will never become one ummah, we are to hard headed for this May allah (swt) spare us all from the hell fire, if this post goes through which am sure a mod wont ? All am asking is that we all look into shia islam, and realize some truth about ahlulbayt. Remember you could die tommorw atleast keep a open mind.
No it proves that you're posting off topic and that you're raising Shubuhat and throwing falsehoods left and right.
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Old 07-26-2011, 02:23 AM   #18
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السلام عليكم

According to the Muslim scholars, those who HATE 'Ali (kw) or al-Hussein ibn 'Ali (ra) have committed a huge sin that could lead them to hellfire.

Loving them is OBLIGATORY even if you don't know anything about their lives and even if you haven't read any books.

As for the differences between the Muslims and the Twelver Shia sect there are plenty of differences, let me just give you an example:

http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/show...d-the-Prophets
Brother, not every sha scholar is right, nor sunni .if you dont know anything about their lives y would you even cruse the family of the prophet (pbuh) in the first place? Why would you cruse anyone for no good reason? Yes there is differences, that will always be true. There is mistakes also.

Also id love to know these muslims scholars, and some video or something showing them saying it. (i am not saying you are wrong)
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Old 07-26-2011, 02:25 AM   #19
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As for ali being the 4th, this is where shia sunni debate. Am debating him being first.
Open another thread if you want to discuss these Ahadith as they have nothing to do with the matters of Caliphate.
Let stick to the one topic, and talk about caliphate inshallah.
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Old 07-26-2011, 02:25 AM   #20
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[QUOTE=TripolySunni;641928]First of all you are off-topic.
Open another thread if you want to discuss these Ahadith as they have nothing to do with the matters of Caliphate.

I was showing that some hadiahs from this book have some falsehood.

Why are you so ignorant to the truth when its in your eyes? Tell me , what do you know about shia islam.?
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