Stances
 

*Mandatory Disclaimer about how I searched the forums for this topic and came up with nothing*
However, if it has been posted, please link me =)

So yesterday, during practice, I was observing a match involving one of our Kendoka vs a Naginataist and I noticed that they Naginata player would switch from Chudan, to hasso, to Waki and so on.

It got me thinking, you see a lot of Jodan, Chudan and, as a Senpai explained to me, a type of gedan. You never see Kendoka using Hasso or waki though. Why is that? Is it not tournament legal? Any insight on this would be greatly appreciated.

You can use hasso and wakigamae in kendo shiai, but you're unlikely to get far. There are a number of reasons but a major one is that the targets you can hit most effectively from these kamae will not get you ippon.

So they are legal?
What do you mean when you say "the targets you can hit most effectively from these kamae will not get you ippon."? Do you mean that you can't effectively hit things such as the Do or Kote? Or do you mean that if you can hit them, but your Zanshin (Or something else) wouldn't be good enough?

You can hit them, but not as effectively as you can from chudan or jodan. From hasso and wakigamae the best targets are areas like the side of the neck, which won't get you ippon.

Each kamae has its strengths and weaknesses, and under the circumstances of kendo shiai some simply aren't as effective as others.

The different types of guard, as I understand it, are for different types of fighting. For example, gedan for going against naginata. wakigamae and hasso wouldn't do much in a fight against someone else close up with a shinai compared to chuudan or joudan, either defensively or offensively.

Just my understanding of this...

I completely agree with Oroshi, and add my two cents....
Once a nanadan japaneese sensei tell us that Hasso no Kamae is a guard with the same attack spirit of jodan, so if you can't assume jodan you can assume Hasso. The causes that can make you not able to assume jodan were basically two. A crested helm (kobuto) or a battle formation. From the little i know of koryu, seems that the older ones (katori shinto to say one) in the cutting motion, don't lift the sword over the head, like classic jodan, but lift it aside, more like hasso, for the same motive, the presence of an helm. Regarding battle formations, you can try to create a row of kenshi in Hasso and make them advance togetheter and cut without harming the neighbour. I did it once and was funny. It’s a pity that battle formations and kobuto are needed no more in modern kendo…
Regarding waki no kamae, every time i assume it in the 4th kata, i feel that the aite leg or the bottom part of his kote would be primary targets for my attack, the same for his neck, but these are not valid targets in kendo. Consequently the rules of modern kendo are such that the only attacks that someone could start from that position, are a gyaku do or a yoko men. The aite knows this, and so is nearly impossible to score these from waki in shiai.....
The same sensei (not remembering who he was, it was one of my first federal event, 7-8 tears ago, sorry) said that waki would be advantageous in the case of an abnormal sword length as a longer than normal or a shorter (maybe you had the upper part broken in a previous fight) one would be invisible to the aite, giving you the advantage of knowing the maai. Again this is more a koryu related thing, as modern shinai are standardized.

I've actually seen a particularly old school kendoka use hasso during a tournament. He favoured seme kote and do and was actually doing reasonably well.

The same sensei (not remembering who he was, it was one of my first federal event, 7-8 tears ago, sorry) said that waki would be advantageous in the case of an abnormal sword length as a longer than normal or a shorter (maybe you had the upper part broken in a previous fight) one would be invisible to the aite, giving you the advantage of knowing the maai. Again this is more a koryu related thing, as modern shinai are standardized. This is what I was taught also: That the purpose of waki is to hide the weapon you are using from your opponent. From waki, your opponent can not be 100% sure whether you are using a katana or tachi, or even attempting to fake him out with a wakizashi. One of the aspects of kendo lost to the sporting side I guess.

If you are wearing traditional samurai armor, waki-gamae presents the fewest openings to an opponent and protects the vulnerable parts of the armor, i.e., the hands and joints of the armor. Basically the only target open to the opponent is the neck and shoulder. This induces the opponent to make a deep cut to reach that target, which opens his hands to counters.

Some koryu applications of waki-gamae-

If the opponent attacks high -- 3:14 of this clip, or 1:08 of this clip, for an unarmored application.

If the opponent attacks low -- 9:54 of this clip.

I once inquired here if one could not attack the hands from below waki-gamae in kendo, and was told that while it was perfectly legal, it would be tough to get the judges to see it as a yuko-datotsu. It'd be a low-percentage move, requiring a lot of practice probably better put to focusing on the essentials of kendo. Also, it's a very defense-heavy kamae, so not as good as other kamae for polishing seme.

Regarding hasso, in addition to the armor considerations mentioned by others above: in Yagyu Shinkage-ryu, what is normally called jodan is called "raito" -- thunder sword. The reason being, one can never tell when or where it is going to strike. From jodan, you can strike straight, or anywhere from head to toe on the opponent's right side, OR, anywhere head to toe on the opponent's left side. The cutting lines of hasso, OTOH, are more delimited. If one's paradigm is unarmored combat, as kendo's is, then there's no good reason for taking hasso rather than the standard jodan.

Hasso leaves your kote very vulnerable. You can hit a strong men from there, though. You can also knock down the incoming kote and hit the men (uchiotoshi men). But I think in tournament likely you'd lose your kote pretty quick.

Thanks for all the replies =D
This has definitely answered the questions I had about why you rarely see these stances in shiai.