[Xcqjwarl]

http://wot.motortrend.com/6687430/te...ine/index.html

I'm guessing mostly to meet Federal Regulations.
Would be nice to see the 2.0L make a come back in the states. In at least the Impreza that is small enough to handle a nice 2.0L.

Sucks that for the consumer for the most part imo. Only suck gains for a complete redesign.

Pretty good engine design if it has only be redesigned once sense 1966. I love engines like that. Engines that have roots from way back when. It is like we still have all these grandfathers hanging out with the new kids in town.

[altosburg]

Thought it was ganna be new Impreza design after they ruined it and made it look like a Mazda! They took the old classic Impreza look away and replaced it with a Mazda hatch back type look.

[tinamasak]

Thought it was ganna be new Impreza design after they ruined it and made it look like a Mazda! They took the old classic Impreza look away and replaced it with a Mazda hatch back type look.

Yea I know, I plan to buy an WRX in the coming years, but it's gonna be an older model. I don't like the look of the newer models, despite them being a tad more powerful and quicker acceleration. The new Impreza's simply don't look like Impreza's anymore.

[HRS1H7gO]

We have had the 2.0L engine here for a long time, in many different specs but youll be unhappy to hear that they are gutless engines in N/A guise.

Even the top of the line 162HP variant in the Legacy 2.0R has to be revved like crazy to get the power out. There was a 156HP version of the same engine in the Impreza 2.0R, less power due to a lower redline, still a bit too peaky and not suited to the transmissions the impreza has.
Lately they replaced it with another 2.0L engine that has 150HP, im guessing its the engine talked about in that article, it is less peaky but again most say its underpowered for the Impreza weight and you certainly dont want it in the bulky new Legacy.

I find it strange that Subaru struggle so much to make a decent N/A engine. I driven many of them and at one stage was going to buy one but i just couldnt live with the lack of power even in 2.5L guise. The latest N/A 2.5L in the forester is decent, its got enough torque but its power output is woefully low for a engine that size.

If you want a N/A 2.0L engine, best to go the Honda/BMW/VW/Audi route, their N/A units are light years ahead of anything Subaru have.

[zilsolley3]

Subaru's 2.2 is a decent n/a motor here in the states,it's torquey at lower rpm's and does well enough even if it could use a little more power.

I don't like what they've done with the newer models though,I'm glad I have one of the good ones,and hopefully here soon I'll finally be able to put some money in to restoring it and upping the hp a bit.

[vTLWqa1l]

complete redesign...

that's like me saying "I'm going to re invent the wheel"

its still got pistons,crankshaft,valves,con rods..

so whats so redesigned about it ?

[Mangoman]

complete redesign...

that's like me saying "I'm going to re invent the wheel"

its still got pistons,crankshaft,valves,con rods..

so whats so redesigned about it ?

the pistons, crankshaft, valve, con rods

[vTLWqa1l]

the pistons, crankshaft, valve, con rods

thats the problem.... they havent, if it was completely redesigned it wouldnt be using pistons, crankshafts, valves and con rods would it...

[HRS1H7gO]

Subaru's 2.2 is a decent n/a motor here in the states,it's torquey at lower rpm's and does well enough even if it could use a little more power.

I don't like what they've done with the newer models though,I'm glad I have one of the good ones,and hopefully here soon I'll finally be able to put some money in to restoring it and upping the hp a bit.

Whats that engine around 110KW (150hp) as well isnt it ? Not great for a 2.2L engine.

A few years ago when i drove the 2005 Impreza 2.5RS (150HP) i always thought that the lack of the power from their non turbo engines came from the fact that they were SOHC engines. Which is understandable because compared to other competitors using inline-4 engines Subaru have much higher costs for cylinder heads on H4 engines and such so its hard to get more power out of them and keep costs low (not an issue with Turbo models which arent as price sensitive)

But unless im mistaken, later models of the 2.xL n/a engines had DOHC (4 OHC), and those are not that powerful either. Its also been said that the subaru flat-4 turbo diesel isnt that torquey for a diesel either (according to car reviewers).

Not sure why this is the case, but im guessing its why really only subaru stick to this configuration for 4 cylinders and nobody else.

[Xcqjwarl]

thats the problem.... they havent, if it was completely redesigned it wouldnt be using pistons, crankshafts, valves and con rods would it...

Are you trying to be a smart a$$?

[Mangoman]

thats the problem.... they havent, if it was completely redesigned it wouldnt be using pistons, crankshafts, valves and con rods would it...

I think you don't understand the difference between redesign and re-invent or something

http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/redesign

[Xcqjwarl]

I find it strange that Subaru struggle so much to make a decent N/A engine. I driven many of them and at one stage was going to buy one but i just couldnt live with the lack of power even in 2.5L guise. The latest N/A 2.5L in the forester is decent, its got enough torque but its power output is woefully low for a engine that size.

If you want a N/A 2.0L engine, best to go the Honda/BMW/VW/Audi route, their N/A units are light years ahead of anything Subaru have.

Subaru's Flat motors are actually my favorite out of all 4 bangers. I have driven a lot of 4 bangers, and they seem to be some of the smoothest and aren't so much like a traditional 4 banger.

The power that the 2.5L makes is totally average power. Most you will find in a N/A motor for a mass selling car (Nothing like the Civic SI type stuff) is 190hp in a 2.4L in the Honda Accord. Other than that most all 2.4/2.5 L engines make roughly 170hp.


They are, or now were, SOHC which makes more of the power in the low and mid range. DOHC can tend to be a little higher. Maybe that is why it fells like it lacks power.
Though now they are DOHC which I am guessing could be because of emissions. Can better control it, and help improve economy a little bit. The turbo models have been DOHC, but I am sure that the turbo models won't use the same parts found in the NA DOHC engines.

Would be interesting to see if maybe Subaru did to where they could also maybe share some parts with the 3.6L H6.

[HRS1H7gO]

Subaru's Flat motors are actually my favorite out of all 4 bangers. I have driven a lot of 4 bangers, and they seem to be some of the smoothest and aren't so much like a traditional 4 banger.

The power that the 2.5L makes is totally average power. Most you will find in a N/A motor for a mass selling car (Nothing like the Civic SI type stuff) is 190hp in a 2.4L in the Honda Accord. Other than that most all 2.4/2.5 L engines make roughly 170hp.

The H4 engines are nice, ive always liked Subarus but the truth is the engines arent that powerful. And id say its below average, if you look at the other technology out there:

Honda 2.4L VTEC 198HP
Honda 2.0L VTEC 200HP
BMW x25i 215HP
Mazda 2.3L 155HP
Toyota 1.8L 2ZZ-GE 190HP
Alfa 2.2L JTS 182HP
Citroen 2.0L 170HP (C4 VTS)
Peugeot 2.0L 180HP (206 GTI 180)
Renault 2.0L 197HP (Clio Sport RS)

Those are just some N/A engines i can think of that really make the Subaru non turbo engines seem lethargic.
Now Subaru does compete with these companies, most of their vehicles are advertised as drivers cars and priced quite high but they fall short of these claims IMO. I mean they have an Impreza 2.0RS "RallySport" that has less than 150HP ? What kind of a farce is that ? Youd be obliterated by any run of the mill warm hatch or sedan (Hot ones would embarrass you), in fact the Jetta 1.4T would outpace it and the Jetta hardly is performance oriented like the Impreza RS is.

Subarus engines n/a engines have not been great since the 1st gen Impreza GC, i think the standard 2.0L produced 100KW, it was one of the few mass production non turbo engines to be able to have such power back then. They have really dropped the ball since then, and whereas the rest of the market is movie towards smaller turbo engines Subaru refuse to offer turbo in anything but their highest end models. Theres a huge gap between the turbo and non-turbo engines.

[zilsolley3]

. I mean they have an Impreza 2.0RS "RallySport" that has less than 150HP ? What kind of a farce is that ? Youd be obliterated by any run of the mill warm hatch or sedan (Hot ones would embarrass you), in fact the Jetta 1.4T would outpace it and the Jetta hardly is performance oriented like the Impreza RS is.

You might be surprised how lively that can be with a 4.11 final drive,or 4.44,especially as the engines produce good torque at around 2200 ish-4000 ish rpm's.

Sure,they aren't the fastest,but you can throw them in to a turn far better than any Honda I have ever driven or encountered on the lovely winding back roads around here,even my outback could just glide through turns without scrubbing much speed.

To me they seem more about maintaining a higher average speed through mixed conditions,which is just perfect for central PA.

[HRS1H7gO]

Well i think that Subaru could do a lot better, they just seem to only bother about WRX and STI while the rest of their other cars are heavily watered down. Its either all out crazy with the big turbos, or nothing at all with them.

The new Legacy is a perfect example, its just a huge bulky bus compared to the all ones before it, the base model 2.0L is less powerful than the outgoing model but the car is heavier...you really have to buy the top end model if you want any kind of good performance. Its becoming more and more like a Toyota Camry each generation.

Even the impreza is becoming just another Jap family saloon. The WRX might as well be a completely different model not associated with the Impreza name, thats how different they are nowdays.
You used to buy an Impreza over a Corolla or Jetta (etc) because of the quirkiness and more hard edged dynamics. Sure you got a bit more plasticky less frills interior but it would perform so much nicer.
Without those things the Impreza is nothing...

[zilsolley3]

Well i think that Subaru could do a lot better, they just seem to only bother about WRX and STI while the rest of their other cars are heavily watered down. Its either all out crazy with the big turbos, or nothing at all with them.

The new Legacy is a perfect example, its just a huge bulky bus compared to the all ones before it, the base model 2.0L is less powerful than the outgoing model but the car is heavier...you really have to buy the top end model if you want any kind of good performance. Its becoming more and more like a Toyota Camry each generation.

Even the impreza is becoming just another Jap family saloon. The WRX might as well be a completely different model not associated with the Impreza name, thats how different they are nowdays.
You used to buy an Impreza over a Corolla or Jetta (etc) because of the quirkiness and more hard edged dynamics. Sure you got a bit more plasticky less frills interior but it would perform so much nicer.
Without those things the Impreza is nothing...

I do have to agree that I don't like where they are going,that's why my 91 Legacy turbo is going to get a lot of money put in to it.

It's a great car,with decent potential.

[vTLWqa1l]

I think you don't understand the difference between redesign and re-invent or something

http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/redesign

its more like a revised engine.

[HRS1H7gO]

I do have to agree that I don't like where they are going,that's why my 91 Legacy turbo is going to get a lot of money put in to it.

It's a great car,with decent potential.

States model with the 2.2L Turbo ? Quite a rare body shape the 1st gen legacy, Japanese spec bodykits are quite nice on those.

Is it possible to transplant the DOHC cylinder head from the Japanese spec engine ? You could rival the latest spec WRX STIs with that engine.

[zilsolley3]

States model with the 2.2L Turbo ? Quite a rare body shape the 1st gen legacy, Japanese spec bodykits are quite nice on those.

Is it possible to transplant the DOHC cylinder head from the Japanese spec engine ? You could rival the latest spec WRX STIs with that engine.

Yes,it is,mine particularly was only made for one year,it's a 5 spd with a vlsd too.

And yes I can take the heads from a ej20g and bolt them right up to get a basic motor setup that's pretty much the same as a JDM 22b Imprezza's,just needs a bigger turbo,bigger injectors and some tuning.

It already puts a smile on my face as it's been de-catted,has a vey non restrictive exhaust and sounds crazy when you mash the gas pedal,but yeah,that's pretty much my plan,better flowing heads and a bigger turbo...And a lot of surprised people.

[Maserati]

The H4 engines are nice, ive always liked Subarus but the truth is the engines arent that powerful. And id say its below average, if you look at the other technology out there:

Honda 2.4L VTEC 198HP
Honda 2.0L VTEC 200HP
BMW x25i 215HP
Mazda 2.3L 155HP
Toyota 1.8L 2ZZ-GE 190HP
Alfa 2.2L JTS 182HP
Citroen 2.0L 170HP (C4 VTS)
Peugeot 2.0L 180HP (206 GTI 180)
Renault 2.0L 197HP (Clio Sport RS)

Those are just some N/A engines i can think of that really make the Subaru non turbo engines seem lethargic.
Now Subaru does compete with these companies, most of their vehicles are advertised as drivers cars and priced quite high but they fall short of these claims IMO. I mean they have an Impreza 2.0RS "RallySport" that has less than 150HP ? What kind of a farce is that ? Youd be obliterated by any run of the mill warm hatch or sedan (Hot ones would embarrass you), in fact the Jetta 1.4T would outpace it and the Jetta hardly is performance oriented like the Impreza RS is.

Subarus engines n/a engines have not been great since the 1st gen Impreza GC, i think the standard 2.0L produced 100KW, it was one of the few mass production non turbo engines to be able to have such power back then. They have really dropped the ball since then, and whereas the rest of the market is movie towards smaller turbo engines Subaru refuse to offer turbo in anything but their highest end models. Theres a huge gap between the turbo and non-turbo engines.

Isn't mitsubishi's 4 banger kind of lame too?