[Fluivelip]

Nazis everywhere.

[Mambattedge]

Stalin or Hitler

some choice

[lerobudrse]

Stalin or Hitler

some choice QFT.

-Arrian

[Galvanoidum]

That's a nazi source. Figures, coming from a Balt..

[ThisIsOK]

Yeah. Everyone is a nazi. It only makes perfect sense.

[LkEHaduy]

Originally posted by Spiffor
And I support the rights of the Estonian russophone minority. Who doesn't?

[fashikn]

Just more bullying out of Russia. In the Baltics the Soviet Union (which mostly means Russian Imperialists) is seen as a hated occupier. The Estonians don't think the location of the Soviet era monument to the Red Army is in an appropriate place given how the vast majority of Estonians hate the the Red Army. The would like to move it some where further away from the capital buildings into a less central place.

[Beatris]

Originally posted by lord of the mark
You support the rights of settlers? Yes. Of them being not second-class citizens, now that the country is established and working.

[Jalieteplalry]

Originally posted by Spiffor

Yes. Of them being not second-class citizens, now that the country is established and working. So if the Estonians had tossed them out back in '91 that would have been cool?

[pfcwlkxav]

Russia has even threatened sanctions with regard to this move. Quite ridiculous - legally speaking, the Estonians are within their rights to do whatever they want here. The statue is in Estonia, and it's not like they are ordering all Russian flags removed from the country or something.

In reality, Russia is bitter that it has completely lost control of the Baltic countries, and it's quite pissed about the fact that Russia is hated by the people of the Baltics.

[pissmanvd]

Is it just me is Estonia's anthem way better than Russia's?

[Kvkcgktl]

Originally posted by Asher
Is it just me is Estonia's anthem way better than Russia's? Gah. You were extremely close to catching me.

[adactthrd]

Originally posted by Spiffor

No. But it would have been understandable.
I hold established countries to higher standards than establishing ones (or than pre-countries) Im not speaking so much of the actions of countries, as of the attitudes of some people toward human beings demonized because they are "settlers"

I certainly believe that it was prudent for Israel to remove the settlers from Gaza. And that it will be prudent for Israel to remove the settlers from those portions of the West Bank that will end up in a Pal state (IE excluding those in Maaleh Adumim and several others) What I dont much like is the attitude expressed here that settlers as a group are less than human, that violence against them is excusable, that their very existence is such an act of aggression that concern for the safety and sympathy at their plight, is a sign of incipient fascism.


Im glad to see that you seem to share my feelings.

[Piemonedmow]

Putin would be poopin.

[Nicihntm]

It's a statue, for silly sakes. Moving a statue does not mean ousting the "settlers." As to Russian sanctions, how dependent is Estonia on Russian economic relations? Incidentally, most Estonians don't think much of Hitler either. So I wouldn't be buying any Adolph statues for resale in Tallinn (sp?).

[Oriesssedleli419]

Originally posted by Saras
This is just another of a myriad of manifestations of Russias post-imperial insecurity/anxiety. It will pass.

This affair also irritating to Russians as it is a subject that has sacred meaning in the Russian psyche, namely, the Great Patriotic War (as they call their part of WW2 against Germany), which is somewhat unwise, imho. Yes. It is kind of like, say, the French relocating dead American troops to somewhere less obvious because of present-day politics. It will certainly continue the strain of relations between Russia, its people, and the West in general.

[leijggeds]

Originally posted by Tacc


Well, considering Finland was an Axis nation.... Co-Belligerent.

(Like said, hard to stay neutral in that climate, and old Joe had allready attacked us...)

Estonia

[viagracheapest]

Right, and what these small countries usually remember is the fact, that Nazi Germany and SU also kind of split the cake and thought they should share it between themselves. Just because Hitler backstabbed Stalin doesn't mean we think Stalin is so much better. One way or the other, these small nations would have been gotten some abuse, but in this case, they got abused by BOTH parties, and now somehow there's an outcry for 'Balts are nazi symphatizers'.

This is difficult for many to understand, but that outcry is coming from a group, that is regarded pretty much the equivalent of nazis. So you there's no really favourites, it's all the same, but different slogans shouted.

THis is NOT to say that when talkinga bout SU or Russia today, that they are regarded as Stalin. This is all related to those days and the groups that were in place THEN, not NOW. The revisionist history telling is also not a favourite of these small nations (victims of both parties, not just one). I do remember rhetorics, where some baltic nations were seeking for admitting, that SU occupied their lands. Should that much be admitted, they could have come and joined the victory day celebrations Putin held, but since the answer was 'How can we occupy lands that belong to us', well, you can agree with that argument, or you can appreciate the situation these countries were in and kind of relate that to the reality, and disagree with it.

[maclaudser]

now somehow there's an outcry for 'Balts are nazi symphatizers'.

Russia feels that way because the Balts are anti-Soviet, hence they "must" be Nazi sympathizers. Additionally, there is this fairly controversial practice by some of the Baltic populations to honour those who served in the German SS. It's fairly controversial indeed - the logic is that those who support these SS legionaries support not the fact that they were SS, but the fact that they fought against the Soviet army, which, in turn, was the occupying force later.

[Tij84ye]

Isn't there like a little rump of Russia that is not connected to the rest of the country, but is in the Baltic. Why don't the Latvuanonians occupy it?