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Old 08-12-2011, 04:32 AM   #1
Sierabiera

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Default Help save Ace from death Friday
DETROIT (WXYZ) - Despite public outcry to save an emaciated dog from being euthanized, Action News has learned that 'Ace' the dog is expected to be put down on Friday.
A stay of Euthanasia has been rejected.
The dog was discovered by Detroit Animal Control on November 4 in an Ace Hardware store in Detroit.Nobody has come forward to claim the Pit Bull.
According to city ordinance, an unlicensed animal can be put down within four days of being captured if an owner does not come forward.
The other obstacle: Animal Control doesn’t hand over Pit Bulls to either adopt or rescue.
Several organizations have volunteered to take responsibility for the animal, including the Detroit Humane Society and the Detroit Dog Rescue.
In a Tuesday meeting, City Council President Charles Pugh asked that there be an exception to the city’s policy of adopting out dangerous breeds.A "Save Ace" facebook page has also been created.Stay tuned to 7 Action News for any updates as they become available.




Read more: http://www.wxyz.com/dpp/news/region/...#ixzz1dAwFwnrP
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Old 08-12-2011, 04:35 AM   #2
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Goodness, he looks pitiful.
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Old 08-12-2011, 04:41 AM   #3
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Just found a more updated story. In the comments there is a list of the Mayor's phone and emails. Feel free to send an email and leave a message telling him to change this policy for Ace and other Pit Bulls and mixes.

http://www.myfoxdetroit.com/dpp/news...ue-20111108-ms
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Old 08-12-2011, 04:54 AM   #4
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God, I'm so mean...

But to me, this just screams "bleeding heart." There are a ton of emaciated brought into animal controls that die without anyone knowing about them... but because this one dog receives publicity, rules should be broken for him? Yes, I feel bad for him... I feel bad for any dog that is mistreated/neglected/abused/etc. what makes THIS dog more worthy than one not given a public plea?

I also don't think everyone should own the breed, and I don't think most animal controls do enough screening to adopt out bull breeds... Releasing to a reliable, proper rescue is different though.

But that's all entirely just my own opinion.
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Old 08-12-2011, 05:00 AM   #5
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I also don't think everyone should own the breed, and I don't think most animal controls do enough screening to adopt out bull breeds... Releasing to a reliable, proper rescue is different though.

Well,that's what they're trying to do.

---------- Post added 11-09-2011 at 12:00 AM ---------- Previous post was 11-08-2011 at 11:58 PM ----------

I wouldn't say he's more "worthy" than other dogs,but if there is a place willing to take him why not? We all know we can't save them all,but that's no reason not save the ones we can.
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Old 08-12-2011, 05:03 AM   #6
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Well,that's what they're trying to do.


I didn't read the second link, so I don't know the details of it. But if they are anything like MY animal control, it doesn't take much to get permission to pull dogs from them and they don't really screen rescues either. Not much different than releasing to the general public..


---------- Post added at 10:03 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:00 PM ----------

I wouldn't say he's more "worthy" than other dogs,but if there is a place willing to take him why not? We all know we can't save them all,but that's no reason not save the ones we can.


I have problems with bleeding heart cases like this, because if the dog isn't temperamentally sound or has some lifelong ailments... people will still plead in his favour because he was emaciated. If the dog were to be pulled, brought to a proper weight and made healthy, then properly evaluated for temperament and euthanized if he wasn't sound, that would be one thing. But from what I've seen, that just usually doesn't happen. I know a "pit bull" who was "saved from starving to death on a chain" who tried to bite me in the face - but it's only because she "had such a rough past". The people who take in dogs like this aren't the same people who can evaluate a dog logically.

I don't know what my deal is tonight... but I'm in a "Not having ANY of it" mood :-/
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Old 08-12-2011, 05:06 AM   #7
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I guess I am just confused on this...if AC never hands over pit bulls to adoption/rescue groups why would this dog be any different? I do not support that mentality but I am not sure why this particular dog is getting so much media when AC probably euthanizes thousands of pit bulls ever year and no rescue groups are fighting for them.
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Old 08-12-2011, 05:10 AM   #8
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Well,that's what they're trying to do.

---------- Post added 11-09-2011 at 12:00 AM ---------- Previous post was 11-08-2011 at 11:58 PM ----------

I wouldn't say he's more "worthy" than other dogs,but if there is a place willing to take him why not? We all know we can't save them all,but that's no reason not save the ones we can.
It's much more about getting the city to change to policy of not adopting Pit Bulls or Pit Bull mixes out to private homes or rescues. Any Pit, or dog that looks like it could be Pit, picked up by Detroit AC either gets picked up by its owner or killed after 4 days. it's BS that they discriminate based on breed/appearance.

---------- Post added at 11:10 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:07 PM ----------

I guess I am just confused on this...if AC never hands over pit bulls to adoption/rescue groups why would this dog be any different? I do not support that mentality but I am not sure why this particular dog is getting so much media when AC probably euthanizes thousands of pit bulls ever year and no rescue groups are fighting for them.
That is part of the problem. Detroit city employees are deaf unless it's on the news making them look bad. The local news wouldn't do jack for a long time of rescues complaining about the policy. Then the Detroit Dog Rescue starts making news, became the local cause celebre, and they took up this dogs cause. So, since DDR is so hot right now,the local media finally did a story on the policy. Most people didn't even know that it was policy to kill Pit Bulls or Pit Bull mixes.. Now they do. And now they will complain.
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Old 08-12-2011, 05:13 AM   #9
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The AC here has the same policy. The Humane Society will adopt them out,however.
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Old 08-12-2011, 05:24 AM   #10
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It is good that Ace's fate is bringing this policy to public light but at this moment Michigan Humane Society is getting absolutely slammed for not taking him in when it is an AC issue. Taking a quick look at their Facebook page they are getting completely blamed for the situation as people do not comprehend the separation of a private animal shelter vs. a public government policy. I hope some of the passion around this continues on and people work on the policy rather than blaming the wrong agency.
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Old 08-12-2011, 05:25 AM   #11
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If it were a Lab, they would hand it over. I think the main point is breed bias.
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Old 09-11-2011, 04:02 PM   #12
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If it were a Lab, they would hand it over. I think the main point is breed bias.
Yup. And that's why I posted it. As much as I do believe in euthanizing dogs of unsound temperament and those severely ill, I am seriously ticked the Detroit AC policy of refusing to release Pit Bulls to anyone but their owners is still in place. You want to euth him because he is not sound, fine. But not simply because of his breed.

---------- Post added at 09:58 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:47 AM ----------

It is good that Ace's fate is bringing this policy to public light but at this moment Michigan Humane Society is getting absolutely slammed for not taking him in when it is an AC issue. Taking a quick look at their Facebook page they are getting completely blamed for the situation as people do not comprehend the separation of a private animal shelter vs. a public government policy. I hope some of the passion around this continues on and people work on the policy rather than blaming the wrong agency.
*sigh* People are stupid. I also hope the HS stops catching flack for the failure of Detroit AC.

I wonder if some of the confusion comes from the past when the HS also refused to adopt out Pit Bulls or Pit Bull mixes. Somewhere around 12 years ago I went to the Westland and Ann Arbor HS trying to help a cat I found that needed vet care. While I was there in the lobby at Westland, some lady brought in a Pit Bull she found in her yard. The dog was youngish, maybe a year or two old, and very, very, friendly. The HS employees were trying hard to convince this lady not to drop off this dog with them because they would euth it if the owner was not found. Of course, the lady said she couldn't keep him and he was left to his fate. It's stuck with me for years and left me with a sour taste in my mouth when it came to the HS.

Then policy changed and they started adopting out Pit Bulls. Now, the Dearborn HS has an awesome bully breed advocacy group that provides low cost vet care, a super spay and neuter program for $20, mandatory obedience classes at a discount with a great trainer for all Pit Bull adopters and they work hard in other ways to change public perception of the breed.

With all the shelters and AC's being slammed for their high kill rates, you'd think Detroit would be willing to change their policy to gain public approval and support.

---------- Post added at 10:02 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:58 AM ----------

As for the cat I was helping, I ended up paying for vet care and keeping him. He ended up having an eye removed and he lived with us for about 2 years. He hated it. He was one of those feral cats that has no desire to domesticate for a softer life. He took off out the door one day when my husbands idiot friend was watching the kids for us so we could go out. Dumbass was hanging out the door hollering for the kids and Socks jetted outside never to be heard from again.
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Old 09-11-2011, 06:03 PM   #13
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I may sound heartless.. but why should that one be treated ANY different than another "pit bull" that comes through the door?
why should that one be allowed to get adopted out or rescued, but not other "pit bulls"? that to me makes absolutely NO sence.

now don't get me wrong, I'd LOVE to see him in a happy home.. heck I'd take one like him in a heartbeat! it truely breaks my heart to see animals suffering.. but truth is.. like Teal said, I bet he isn't the first to come through their doors like that, why should he be treated any different than the others if there is no intention in changing the rules for ALL the "pit bulls" in that facility?
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Old 09-11-2011, 06:53 PM   #14
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Again, Ganja, missing the point. The point is to make people aware the DAC does not adopt out Pit Bulls to either rescues or citizens. This is something most people did not know until this case hit the news. DAC will not change policy until people start demanding it, which they won't do unless they are aware. It's not about this one dog. It's about using this one dog to change the policy that kills dogs due to nothing more than breed. Use this case as a precedent setter for suture cases or to change the policy totally.

We're gearing up for elections here next year. With enough disapproval and complaints, they city council and mayor will change policy just to keep their jobs.
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Old 09-11-2011, 07:51 PM   #15
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Yes, it's wrong that they are discriminating against the breed - but if they were to change their policies, do they have proper screening to adopt out Pit Bulls? People keep crying out for equality for the breed - but the truth is, they AREN'T equal to other breeds and they need more strict placement processes than your average mutt.
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Old 09-11-2011, 08:27 PM   #16
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But to me, this just screams "bleeding heart." There are a ton of emaciated brought into animal controls that die without anyone knowing about them... but because this one dog receives publicity, rules should be broken for him? Yes, I feel bad for him... I feel bad for any dog that is mistreated/neglected/abused/etc. what makes THIS dog more worthy than one not given a public plea?
What does the "tons" of other hypothetical dogs have to do with this dog we are talking about? Who said this dog is any more or less deserving than any other hypothetical dog in a shelter?

The reality is, THIS dog just happened to get the attention(something completely out of the control of the dog) of people who want to save him, so its a good thing, atleast for this dog, no other dog has anything to do with this. If you want to make a seperate topic of all these "other" dogs, feel free to do so.

I also don't think everyone should own the breed, and I don't think most animal controls do enough screening to adopt out bull breeds... Releasing to a reliable, proper rescue is different though.
The only way to control who can or cannot own the breed or any breed is though BSL.

As for adopting out bully breeds, there is no evidence to suggest that the dogs that give bully breed a bad name came from shelters.
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Old 09-11-2011, 09:17 PM   #17
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[/B]What does the "tons" of other hypothetical dogs have to do with this dog we are talking about? Who said this dog is any more or less deserving than any other hypothetical dog in a shelter?

The reality is, THIS dog just happened to get the attention(something completely out of the control of the dog) of people who want to save him, so its a good thing, atleast for this dog, no other dog has anything to do with this. If you want to make a seperate topic of all these "other" dogs, feel free to do so.

[B]

The only way to control who can or cannot own the breed or any breed is though BSL.

As for adopting out bully breeds, there is no evidence to suggest that the dogs that give bully breed a bad name came from shelters.


Except those other dogs are NOT hypothetical.

My point is - WHAT makes THIS dog worthy of changing rules and being saved? Because he was emaciated? Sorry - that's not enough for me. Who knows what his temperament is really like - if he's genetically healthy (what if he has horrible hip dysplasia, a heart condition, etc. etc.). Yes - every other bull breed in the shelter where this dog is has to do with this! Why this dog, and none of them? Because he happened to get publicity and they didn't? Doesn't work for me.

My point in not adopting out bully breeds has NOTHING to do with publicity, i.e. whether the dogs giving bully breeds a bad name came from shelters or not. My point is the well being of the dogs. Animal controls adopt out dogs to multiple dog homes with no contingencies about the dogs meeting first. People adopting from a shelter, in general, have probably not done the research necessary to bring a bull breed into their home. Then when the dog doesn't get along with their resident dogs, or tears things up because they don't get enough exercise... they end up right back in the shelter. Sure, you can argue the OTHER side of it - that tons of dogs are adopted straight from shelters without issues... but it's all a matter of opinion and which side of the issue you are on.
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Old 09-11-2011, 10:20 PM   #18
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Except those other dogs are NOT hypothetical.
They are...in this thread.

This thread is about this dog. Any and all other dogs are completely irrelavent to this dog. Some people are trying to give THIS dog another chance. It has nothing to do with other dogs being more or less deserving. Because for every dog that gets adopted or saved, there is another dog that could have been adopted or saved instead, that is reality, and in reality you cant save them all. It says nothing about the dog that gets adoped out or saved being more worthy or deserving than the dogs that dont get the chance, the dog never asked to be saved, just that this dog happened to be the lucky one some person chose.

My point is - WHAT makes THIS dog worthy of changing rules and being saved?
Obviously nothing to you. But there are other people who think this dog deserves to be saved. And with any and all pets, their "worth" or "value" is dependent on the individual person. Dogs do not have the ability to put a value on themselves, it is people who judge and put value on these animals. And who are you to say what value other people on whatever animal of their choosing? After all, your pets might be worthless to me, you might feel differently, but in the end of the day neither you or I have have any right to tell each other what worth we should put on any animal. So if other people think this dog deserves to be saved, that is that, and if you dont, good for you, be on your merry way.

People adopting from a shelter, in general, have probably not done the research necessary to bring a bull breed into their home. Then when the dog doesn't get along with their resident dogs, or tears things up because they don't get enough exercise... they end up right back in the shelter.
Once again, this is a hypothetical based on your assumptions and generalizations. Without any sort of data on how many of adopted dogs end up back in the shelter for the reason you provided, you cant really make a case one way or the other.
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Old 09-12-2011, 12:57 AM   #19
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It was entirely pointless for me to read all the crap you just wrote. You don't make any valid points, aside from trying to tell me I'm wrong. I can't be wrong, considering it's my opinion. Sorry if it differs from yours - but that is life.
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Old 09-12-2011, 01:39 AM   #20
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Here's the thing..

No, we don't know the dog's temperament. No, the DAC does not do temperament testing on the dogs it adopts out. The other local AC's don't temperament test, either. And they do adopt out bully breeds. So, the DAC could adopt out a dog of another powerful breed (Chow, GSD, Rottie, Dobe, and a few others come to mind) that is of poor temperament and goes on to attack people. But they can't adopt out a Pit Bull?

It's not about the dog or the dogs temperament. It's about being unbiased and fair. Any of the dogs in the hundreds of AC's in the state can be unsound and HA, but they aren't getting put down arbitrarily due to breed.
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