lol good point!....still...ill take the producer............

http://www.pitbull-chat.com/images/smilies/biggrin.png.....ive had some of the gamest photos the world has ever seen http://www.pitbull-chat.com/images/smilies/lol.gif

Furthermore, if you're a good, ethical breeder, why would you be breeding a crap dog in the first place just to see what she can throw you?

http://www.pitbull-chat.com/images/smilies/lol.gif

---------- Post added at 02:19 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:17 PM ----------

The "crap dog" that is being discussed here is a cold dog. There should be no problem with a cold dog being bred provided that blood pair up would be nice combo.

The currs are a different story.

call me old fashioned but you wouldnt catch me breeding a cold bitch....any man breeding for performance should be breeding proven animals......anything else is a compromise on the dogs,the sport and on the breeder himself.

tell that to honeybunch, although im sure she wasnt necessarily "cold", but definately not a proven match dog, for what its worth.


shit look at frisco, the only thing he's proven was to have a golden dick! yet he's gotten more pussy than ron jeremy! and consistently throwin bulldogs! lol

that dont make it correct breeding principals.....some folk drink and drive without killing anybody it dont make it right !

honeybunch was the baddest producin bitch of her time?!?!

the same argument can be held about frisco, although frisco dogs arent really of that much interest to me saying that he aint producin top shelf bulldogs would be ignorant.

so because of 2 exceptional individuals that went against the grain....do you therefore recommend the procedure of breeding untested unproven animals for performance ??????

its like walking across the road with your eyes shut,just because you get away with it dont mean its sensible practise http://www.pitbull-chat.com/images/smilies/no2.gif

i cant believe we,re even having this conversation

no im not saying it SHOULD or SHOULDNT be done, but the topic @ hand is performance vs producing. i agree why go and breed to a cold dog out of the litter when you got his brother thats already a 2x'r, but thats considering you dont know how either dog is producin. both ways are shots in the dark, but atleast you have more sense of security when breedin to the winner.

if you got a performer & a producer in one dog than i say your in business!, but how often is that, more times than not its one or the other. so if i had a choice (considering i know what i got to choose from before hand) between a performer who cant produce shit & a stone cold bitch that produces bulldogs, give me the producer.

atleast the producer will get you in the right direction with your program, the performer that cant produce wont give you anything to start with.

your looking at it from a breeders perspective only......

the answer to the topic question is going to be the same as the other question about breeding the best or showing the best.

a breeder wants to produce......the matcher wants to win.....

the big difference is the breeder dont produce anything good without the man with the dog between his legs http://www.pitbull-chat.com/images/smilies/wink.png

thats why for me its performance every time.

fair enough, which leads us to the next thread.........sportsmen vs dogmen lol

i know more times than not that the dogmen is also a sportsmen & vice versa but thats not every story....

Yea.. Frisco is never tested.. was once rolled once I believe and that's it. I think it's NC who said that, I might be wrong. http://www.pitbull-chat.com/images/smilies/lol.gif

---------- Post added at 06:23 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:58 PM ----------

It's your turn to create that thread LWG. Me and mr.clueless done our part! http://www.pitbull-chat.com/images/smilies/lol.gif

---------- Post added at 06:55 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:23 PM ----------

This is true.. that is really a breeder's principle of breeding cold bitches. Personally, all my peers considered performance above anything else when breeding. One of my friends even tested a 1xW Amstaff breed to a 2xW jeep/redboy bitch and produced Ch Baskin. In the [] the bloodline won't be measured but the heart of the dog.

I like the phrase I bold out. http://www.pitbull-chat.com/images/smilies/biggrin.png

Laced are you talking about CHAMPION Honeybunch being a untested cold dog??

I'm not a historian on pitbulls but I believe she is just a cold dog until the age 3? Then finally turned on and earned her Ch title?

yea, i realize she's CH and all, but i remember reading that the dog wasnt really [] material or not very talented anyways. i never questioned it as i dunno if she was matched under cajun rules or s2w.

I'd take the performer. Hands down..I want people to remember my dog for what HE is AND what he produces. BUT given the choice of one or the other.....I'll take the performer!

for me a good dogman IS a sportsman.......

a breeder relies on a handful of luck....a sportsman CANNOT rely on luck !!

Best producing bitch ever to this day. http://www.pitbull-chat.com/images/smilies/biggrin.png
What her ROM something like 7?

IMO you have a breeder and a dogman eg: Lester Huges vs Clouse, ill be Fatbill dogman/breeder hahaha

yea some of the best dogmen were sportsmen, but not all of them. from what i heard is that hollingsworth never matched a dog in his life, but still...put some good ones out there.