[Lillie_Steins]

Originally posted by andak01
Because it isn't the whole Islamic world. And the Quran itself validates the sons of Joseph and the sons of Abraham. Just like Jesus railed at the Pharasees, so the Quran rails at hypocrites Jewish or otherwise, but not all Jews. And in the end, it isn't us who judge, it's God. Now, you're right if you say that not enough Muslims are aware of this. They should all be. Please tell us which Jews are not considered "hypocrites" by the Koran.

Is it true that Muslims are taught that the Torah was altered long ago and that modern Jews are followers of a "false religion"?

[Big A]

Now present the equally numerous anti-semitic statements found in Islam.

Then note that the greatest Jewish philosopher, Maimonides, argued just the opposite: that righteous Christians and Muslims will share in the life to come with righteous Jews.

[doctorzlo]

Originally posted by andak01


Here's a little what the New Testament says about the Jews: Seeing this from andak, reminds me of an article I read a while ago. andak and others will probably find plenty to dislike about the author and lots more to attack the source.


http://www.cdn-friends-icej.ca/antiholo/newtest.html

Is the New Testament Anti-Semitic?



by Clifford Goldstein, Liberty, March/April 1992

What book depicts Jews as hypocrites, apostates, liars, and sinners? What book denounces Jewish leaders and the Jewish nation? What book scolds its priests, claims its Temple services are corrupt, and spews forth warnings that God's judgments will fall upon the Jews? What book - accusing the Jews of murder, corruption, greed, and robbery - declares that they have forsaken God?

Sounds like the New Testament, long indicted as the Perian Spring of Western anti-Semitism. Some believe the hands that signed the "final solution" simply finished the script begun by Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John. Hitler, others claim, was the logical, inevitable result of Paul. Christian historian James Parkes writes that "more than 6 million deliberate murders are the consequences of the teaching about the Jews for which the Christian church is ultimately responsible, and our attitude to Judaism which is not only maintained by all Christian churches but has its ultimate resting place in the teaching of the New Testament itself."

"The New Testament," writes Harry Kimball, "is the primary source of anti-Semitism. "The authors of the Gospels," wrote Jewish historian Heinrich Graetz, "by putting these words of violent hatred against the preservers of Judaism into the mouth of Jesus Himself, stamped Him thereby as a relentless foe of the members of His own race who did not believe in Him by clung to their original faith."

Yet the book described in the opening paragraph is not the New Testament - it is the Old! Indeed, if the criteria for determining anti-Judaism in the New Testament were applied to the Old, it would be declared the more anti-Jewish of the two.

Incorrigible Villains:

Scholars have long debated about anti-Judaism in the New Testament, but rarely, if at all, anti-Judaism in the Old. It, after all, is a book written about Jews, by Jews who considered themselves loyal Jews. Yet except for Luke (not considered the most anti-Jewish of the Gospel writers), the New Testament was written about Jews, by Jews who considered themselves loyal Jews too.

The New Testament, tough, has pages of anti-Jewish calumny. "The New Testament contains 102 references to the Jews of [the] most degrading and malevolent kind," wrote Dagobert Runes, "thereby creating in the minds and hearts of the Christian children and adults ineradicable hatred toward the Jewish people."

In the Gospels, Jewish leaders, priests, scribes, and Pharisees play the role of incorrigible villains. Depicted as cold and heartless formalists, they appear pious outside but seethe with treachery inside. Jesus labels them hypocrites, deceivers, even murderers - words later used to help formulate a theology of anti-Semitism. "Nowhere is this theological anti-Judaism more apparent," writes Princeton religious historian John G. Gager, "than in the dialogue between Jesus and the Pharisees in {John} 8." Here, after telling Jewish leaders that they are not the true children of Abraham, and accusing them of plotting His murder, Jesus says, "Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning" (verse 44).

Matthew 23 is nothing but a denunciation: "But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! ... Ye blind guides ... Ye fools and blind .... Fill ye up then the measure of your fathers. Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?" (verses 13-33).

The Gospel writers depict Jewish leaders as planning Jesus' death: "And the scribes and chief priests ... sought how they might destroy him" (Mark 11:18). Indeed, all the Gospels implicate the leaders in His death.

Jesus' denunciations not only of the leaders but also of the nation have fueled the anti-Semite's fire. In Luke 20, Jesus, symbolizing Israel as a vineyard, tells of a master who planted a vineyard and "let it forth to husbandmen" (verse 9). Later when the servants came to collect the fruit from the master's vineyard, the husbandmen beat them. He sent more servants, and they beat them too. Finally the master says, "I will send my beloved son: it may be they will reverence him when they see him" (verse 13). Instead, the husbandmen killed him! Said Jesus: "What therefore shall the lord of the vineyard do unto them? He shall come and destroy these husbandmen, and shall give the vineyard to others" (verses 15, 16). Luke recorded the leaders' response: "And the chief priests and the scribes the same hour sought to lay hands on him; and they feared the people; for they perceived that he had spoken this parable against them" (verse 19).

Matthew has Jesus blaming the Jews for the murder of the prophets - "O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee" (Matthew 23:37) - and leveling a judgment upon them: "Behold, your house is left unto you desolate" (verse 38).

The Gospels depict Jesus as critical also of national religious rites and of the nation, including the worship at the Temple - criticisms gleefully seen as anti-Jewish polemics. At the start of His ministry Jesus cleansed the Temple from merchants who had turned it into an unsanctified flea market. "And [He] said unto them, It is written, My house shall be called a house of prayer; but ye have made it a den of thieves" (Matthew 21:13). He warns that even the Temple itself, the center of the Jewish religion, will be destroyed: "And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple: and his disciples came to him for to shew him the buildings of the temple. And Jesus said unto them. See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down" (Matthew 24:1, 2).

The New Testament, obviously, portrays many Jews in ancient Israel as corrupt, iniquitous, and separated from God. Does this description, therefore, mean that the book is anti-Jewish? For many scholars, both Jew and Gentile, it does.

I guess that old Moses with his long list of Deuteronomy prophecies and curses about Israel , should the nation fall into sin, must have been a self hating anti semite.





(continued)

[Slonopotam845]

It's ironic, this attempt by andak, to somehow pretend that Islam and Judaism are compatible and then to subtly suggest that their "real" common enemy is, quite naturally, Christianity.

It's ironic since he is talking about Joseph.

Sometimes, the Muslim line might go that Islam and Christianity are compatible and then their "real" common enemy is, quite naturally, "the Jews".

Neither Muslim line are anything new.

But lets also recall that Islam is a religion setup to abrogate or abolish two others. Lets recall that Islam teaches that Jews and Christians corrupted the Scripture and that Muslims alone have God's revelation. Lets recall that Islam appropiates and remoulds Jewish tradition and claims Biblical figures for it's own teaching . And since andak brings up Joseph, lets also recall the fury with which Muslims destroyed Joseph's Tomb again and again in recent years. (not 500 or 800 years ago)

[Drugmachine]

Originally posted by humus_sapiens
Andak,
Why bring this up on the IsraelForum, while the whole Islamic world is seething with genocidal hatred to the the sons of Joseph? Because it isn't the whole Islamic world. And the Quran itself validates the sons of Joseph and the sons of Abraham. Just like Jesus railed at the Pharasees, so the Quran rails at hypocrites Jewish or otherwise, but not all Jews. And in the end, it isn't us who judge, it's God. Now, you're right if you say that not enough Muslims are aware of this. They should all be.