[nd90t3sf]

Usually I leave this kind of thing alone. But lately, it seems like everyone is falling over themselves to jump on anybody whose posts feel the slightest bit misguided. I don't think we need to be all soft and fuzzy here, but at the same time I'd prefer to see people give helpful information and the benefit of the doubt first. In future I won't hesitate to lock threads where I feel things are out of control. People who I feel are being unnecessarily harsh will get a "newbie harassing" infraction.

[imporrilk]

I agree. I don't understand why so may forum members jump on people who don't, can't, won't train at a recognised dojo.
Yes some of these people may be trolls. But a good portion most probably do have a genuine interest in learning a martial art (in this case kendo).

For those who don't want t train at a dojo shouldn't we encourage them to at least turn up at one and see what is going on, and explain why you need a group to develop. (Yes we have had some unique people turn up and what our training and decide not to join.)

Why not support those who really are stuck in the middle of nowhere. A 4 hour round trip to get to training is a bit excessive for most people.

Why is it a participants fault if they join a McDojo and they didn't know better? Don't you think a better option to recommend they check out other dojos and let them make up their own minds. If you tell someone there wrong their natural reaction is to defend themselves, if your non judgmental you give them a way out.

Don't you want to encourage people to do kendo. To travel through the highs and lows. For them to feel the satisfaction we feel after a good / hard training. The pain of trying to hard and losing the plot, or the joy of winning a match again a superior opponent. For that split second when you sense perfection only to lose it again. For most people kendo is not for them and I am fine with that.
Why scare them off before the even start. I am willing to give people a chance and a support arm.

Anyway my Mother always said
"If you don't have anything nice to say, then don't say anything"

[Cydayshosse]

i am not qualified to pass judgements, however, i agree with Neil.

also, i want to say this (just so as many people can read it and become aware of this as possible)

while there are no set rules (or are there?) that dictates the manners we should conduct ourselves on internet forum. My view is that we should leave our personal "baggage" outside of KW. (of course, i know I don't do a very good job at this myself) But, point being, sometime i feel like clearly cynicism and mockery is so innate of some bloggers on here that I wonder if they are "happy" in their lives. Perhaps they are, but then again, my bet is that these individuals are at large very stressed in their evry day life. So as the saying goes, "what goes around comes around". the world just keeps turning in circles. Some might even justify their words by misguided fallacies that most just follow suit. So, I hope we can keep this forum which many of us has grown attached to as a place where people (regardless of gender,age, experience, etc) feel like they are being "helped", instead of being put down.

[sposicke]

. . .I don't think we need to be all soft and fuzzy here, but at the same time I'd prefer to see people give helpful information and the benefit of the doubt first. . .

I agree.

That being said, and at the risk of invoking the dreaded hammer of death, I must say that I could not agree less with Messrs. Martino and Massahiro, albeit for different reasons, none of which are particularly germain to this particular discussion.

[BoBoMasterDesign]

I agree, but I think it depends on the situation.

For example, one of our guys who has just finished his beginners, is in bogu and doing really well, was someone who got slammed for getting on some threads arguing about ninjas. Some people were especially nasty to him, despite the fact that he said from the very start that he was interested in doing kendo, wanted to go to a dojo, was polite and willing to listen to what people advised him. Even after he proved himself to be a good kid, he still got hammered by some people.

However, if someone is a deliberately obnoxious, offensive, little twerp then I think they deserve what they get. Not just the obvious trolls. I know there are meny divided opinions about our little friend KendokaHan on this basis. He keeps saying he wants to learn kendo but manages to annoy the crap out of everyone.

I invited him to train with us or watch a practice at my dojo (back when I thought he was a shodan). He didnt bother.
Someone from another club in Perth invited him to their dojo. He didnt bother.
A couple of us invited him to come along to a tournament to watch. He didnt bother. So I have no patience or sympathy for people like him.

So I guess I agree, in the way that people should be more encouraging. When a person proves themselves to be a waste of time, then I happy to sit back with the popcorn and enjoy the show.

Just my two cents worth.

[marcusdexz]

I'll sign on for anything that involves treating each other with a bit more respect and exercising a little self control and discipline. I think it is very unfortunate that the so-called newbies are routinely trampled on by those with more knowledge and experience, whose role should be that of cyber-mentor, if you will. This ain't the NBA... thank God.

[gettoblaster]

I agree that we shouldnt bash the new guys.
But. This last guy, was just a troll. "I sleep with my bokken hoping to become one with it" Thats just tempting us
other then that. I'll clean up my act. I dont know if Ive been doing any bashing that was considered out of place, but Ill watch my step I wouldn't want my ass kicked by a bunch of adult men dressed as batman making vulgar gestures

[klubneras]

I agree that we shouldnt systematically bash the new guys.

[attishina]

I think the troll hunters should do more suburi and less hunting and bashing.

Think more about your training about being tollerant how would you like to be treated being new on a forum.

And no but....

If someone turns out to be a rotten apple then so be it.

Shouldn't our training make us balanced and relaxed people instead of this jumpy, or is it that some are just so excited to see new people that they just don't know how to behave anymore and at the first sign of McDojo they put them into the box of bad and troll.

Just be positive and pleasant to each other and if others want to troll then let them, it's all about how we treat each other and how we show the new members how to behave.

Have a nice day everyone

[Vomephems]

I agree with Iggz and Alison.

[Lydiaswingert]

Seeing as I am bored and stuck at work, I will disagree just for shits and giggles.

The KW membership seems to be made of (mostly) the following people:

a) practicing JSA people
b) genuine people looking to study JSA
c) backyard kids wanting to fit in but can't be arsed to train properly

I don't have a problem with any of the above, but if c) are here just for some sort of recognition of their backyard budo skills, I say that leaves them open for being pulled down, publicly or not. It is not about 'bashing new guys' - there have been loads on here who have been referred to dojo and either have taken advice or ignored it. If it is the latter, is what we do wrong?

Examples of late:

Kendoka_Han: Claimed to be a yondan (or godan - can't remember) in kendo on another forum, and a master of a koryu art that is as rare as rocking horse shit. He got called and outed, like everyone else who tries this. I discussed his 'going to a dojo' with him via PM - even talked to him about his behaviour on the forum privately and his multiple dan grade lies. His response? OK, I will behave AND prove you all wrong by learning kendo. The reality? He posts even more crap and gets calls for his banning from the forum.

A typical example of a misguided kid who doesn't respond well to advice.

Napoleon: Another 'I have kendo experience' fabricator. He posts nonsense and people jump on him. His response (which I thought was awesome!) got him banned by Mr Genz.

A typical example of a kid who goes off like a bottle of fizzy pop. Ideal MA material? Maybe, once his hormones have calmed down.

There have been loads of others (my favourite was the kid who took shuriken to school in his pencil case - I emailed his headmaster, by the way!) but what should we do? Treat the obvious basket cases with kid gloves or just refer them to the mods?

[Lidawka]

I agree that we should not just attack the newbies (we were ones as well some tiem ago), but when they come onto a legitimate forum and lie about their skills (and even post Youtube links to show how bad they are) then to me, they are fair game.

As members of this forum i feel that we too should be treated with respect and if someone with more experience in a legitimate art gives you information and advice then we shoudl take it. But if a backyard Ninjer comes on offering us advice then I feel we are within our rights to disagree and point out their errors.

(steps down of soap box)


David

[plogypeskelry]

it's like looking at bush sr. and jr. kinder, gentler KW forum, or shock and awe way of handling the newbies personally prefer time honored internet tradition of light bashing of newbies on the forum.. but what do i know..

pete

[valiumcheapll]

a) "Hi there, I want to learn genuine JSA - can anyone point me in the right direction?"

KW - "Sure, go 'there' or 'there'. Let us know how you get on." [claps newbie on back]

b) "Hi there, I am an obvious teenage ninjer fraud and can't be arsed to change my ways."

KW - "Prepare to repel boarders!" [kicks chump up the arse]



What's wrong with that?

[kucheravka]

Sorry about the double post, but:

People who I feel are being unnecessarily harsh will get a "newbie harassing" infraction.

I would like to appeal against an 'infraction'. What is the process for doing this? I don't feel any part of my post was inflammatory - the thread was started for kendoka-han (who posted an earlier thread of apology - what good it did) to address the issues people had with him in an open debate. If he wants to be taken seriously, he's gotta win people over and fix what he has broken.

Please see my post above about the various PMs between me and him in regards to getting him 'on the straight and narrow'. Nothing was 'uncessessarily harsh'.

[irrelaAnnekly]

Nothing was 'uncessessarily harsh'.

Your opinion doesn't have any bearing. The moderator makes that decision.
I suspect Mr. Gendzwill's duties as moderator are about to become more onerous.

[picinaRefadia]

My post was for Neil, but thanks for chirping in with your opinion.

[karaburatoreror]

My post was for Neil, but thanks for chirping in with your opinion.

If you have a post for only one member then perhaps you should use PM (which I know you are able to use)

on the other hand:

Your opinion doesn't have any bearing. . . .

Whooo-hooo. Aren't we being a little harsh here?

[BashBeissedat]

Sorry about the double post, but:I would like to appeal against an 'infraction'. What is the process for doing this?

About the same process as appealing a call in a match, expect the same results. It will go away in a month. It's just a way of saying "cut that out".

The problem with your post was that kendoka han had already been thoroughly trashed. Creating another thread for the express purpose of harassing him some more was unnecessarily harsh.

As for the other kid, he posted three times, which you and others declared sufficient evidence to put him in the same pile with 2swordstyle. Kids have all kinds of notions. His comment about standing on a log might have been misguided, it might even have been a joke. You didn't give him the chance to respond to any sort of useful advice. Kaoru didn't even get a chance to post a 10-page missive to him.

[Asianunta]

Hehe received and understood. Will await Kaoru's tome before online murder in future.

(Oh, and I never jumped on Napoleon's back, as I am sure you noticed... )