[Adwetyren]

he amended the charge to part A and and got my defense thrown out...

then I had the opportunity to post an appeal bond of $500 or pay the fine for $105...


the funny thing is I messed this one up for myself...

several months ago I discussed this with the prosecutor in hopes that he would drop in... I basically screwed up and handed him his case... if I had just kept my damned month shut and waited for trial he would not have known how to proceed on this case...

So just to recap, you didn't win this one?

[Slchtjgb]

That's my interpretation of what the "A" paragraph is referring to.


A. No person shall equip any motor vehicle with a communications device tuned or fixed to receive or
transmit messages on any frequency used by the Police Department, (that would mean a CB radio, scanner or HAM radio, that could receive or transmit on police frequencies ) or have or use the same in any motor
vehicle within the City limits, unless such motor vehicle is used or owned by the City of Independence,
Missouri, or other publicly owned and controlled law-enforcement agency, or, that person is an amateur radio operator with a Federal Communications Commission License, without first securing a permit from the Chief of Police.

Unless their referring to a wireless signal from a police computer, then they are referring to a Radio that sends spoken messages, unless the plods around his way use morse code.

I don't know if it makes a difference a radar signal is an oscillating wave form sent over a radio frequency. As has already been mentioned the judge isn't going to defer his judgment to Merriam Webster. I wouldn't be surprised if a radio frequency broadcasting a sine wave can be considered a message and there is no doubt that a radar detector is a device designed to receive the sine wave on a police frequency.

Someone might have said the law is an ass but they word these things very carefully for a reason. There is no way I would want to try and argue a point of law with no experience that's why you hire a lawyer who will know if there is a chance of disputing the fact and will refer to other similar cases. If you as a citizen walk into a court and try and personally argue something like that you are most likely going to come across as a smart ass. Especially since anyway you look at it that is a device used to intercept a signal on a police frequency before it is capable of doing it's job properly.

[choollaBard]

So just to recap, you didn't win this one?

nope I got slammed... lol [rofl]

[Adwetyren]

nope I got slammed... lol [rofl]

ROFL. I got done over the same once. I tried to fight a train ticket evasion conviction rather than just pay the fine. I got my ass handed to me by three octogenarians on the bench.

[choollaBard]

I don't know if it makes a difference a radar signal is an oscillating wave form sent over a radio frequency. As has already been mentioned the judge isn't going to defer his judgment to Merriam Webster. I wouldn't be surprised if a radio frequency broadcasting a sine wave can be considered a message and there is no doubt that a radar detector is a device designed to receive the sine wave on a police frequency.

Someone might have said the law is an ass but they word these things very carefully for a reason. There is no way I would want to try and argue a point of law with no experience that's why you hire a lawyer who will know if there is a chance of disputing the fact and will refer to other similar cases. If you as a citizen walk into a court and try and personally argue something like that you are most likely going to come across as a smart ass. Especially since anyway you look at it that is a device used to intercept a signal on a police frequency before it is capable of doing it's job properly.

if you look at the way part A is worded it says 'MESSAGES'... a radar gun can not be used to send messages and therefore a radar detect can not receive police messages...

however... the City Prosecutor did get very red in the face and looked like his head was going to explode when I said that... lol [rofl]

then he got the judge to throw out what I had said...

[choollaBard]

the jerks just want the money. they clearly didn't have a case against you but they twisted the law to suit them. typical.. a radar detector is not a communication device by any stretch of the imagination.. if you had gotten a lawyer you would have won clearly, but it would have cost you much more that the 100 fine. it's bullshit that they didn't drop the ticket and sadly many small towns play that game and twist the laws to suit them just for the money. many of them use tickets to pay for what they can't get with taxes. it's criminal but since they are the "court" there is nothing that can be done about it, except play the game and give money to the courts or your lawyer. it's a sad game some of them play with honor and justice.

Finally someone that see's my point... thank you sir! [thumbup]

[Adwetyren]

Finally someone that see's my point... thank you sir! [thumbup]

I never said I didn't see your point, I said you were crazy to try and fight it without a lawyer

[MrsGoo]

Finally someone that see's my point... thank you sir! [thumbup]

Yes, you got screwed!
If the "LAW" is to be respected, it has to apply as written - judges and prosecuters can't chop and change it to suit themselves!

[illetrygrargo]

Yes, you got screwed!
If the "LAW" is to be respected, it has to apply as written - judges and prosecuters can't chop and change it to suit themselves!

The duty of a judge is the come to a ruling based on how the evidence presented a case for the prosecutor's interpretation of a law. Believe it or not, the laws in our books are not "be all, end all" and are not totally all encompassing of every situation that can occur. This is why Lawyers exist.

Of course, if you don't agree with the ruling, this is also why Appeals Courts exist.

[Hmwmzian]

the jerks just want the money. they clearly didn't have a case against you but they twisted the law to suit them. typical.. a radar detector is not a communication device by any stretch of the imagination.. if you had gotten a lawyer you would have won clearly, but it would have cost you much more that the 100 fine. it's bullshit that they didn't drop the ticket and sadly many small towns play that game and twist the laws to suit them just for the money. many of them use tickets to pay for what they can't get with taxes. it's criminal but since they are the "court" there is nothing that can be done about it, except play the game and give money to the courts or your lawyer. it's a sad game some of them play with honor and justice.

yep, I totally agree with this and it's totally unethical. smashed, you got screwed by an unethical system. my dad once tried to get a ticket thrown out because a policeman was on the otherside of a traffic light and said my dad turned when it was yellow (but he was misunderstood the trafic pattern and couldn't see the actual signal) I was in the car with my dad, and my dad asked him to go on the other side of the light and it proves the cop misunderstood and it was an actual green arrow signal. the cop agreed and when it basically proved he was wrong, he was embarrassed and felt bad, but he didn't have the integrity to admit it and said "well you should go to court then"[rolleyes]

We went to court with video evidence and the judge basically just laughed and said to my dad "wow....you have a clean record, you haven't had a ticket in 20 years" and then the redneck judge didn't even listen to the argument, just ruled against my dad. My dad said he was disapointed that the court and the policeman lacked integrity and honesty and the judge threatened to hold him in contempt. Anyways....lesson learned. Most judges won't even listen to your side unless you pay for a lawyer. It's basically a rigged system. They were once lawyers, and they are insulted unless you have one yourself and "that's just the way the system works"

anyhow, my dad then had a meeting with the Mayor (who is a friend of ours) and the mayor basically told us what I described above (you're never going to get a fair shake in cases like that) and he threw out the ticket and had it expunged from my dad's record.

interesting lesson I learned as a teenager and have never forgotten. the other thing I took away from it is there really is nothing more despicable than a judge who does not care about justice, or policeman who lack honesty.

[choollaBard]

I never said I didn't see your point, I said you were crazy to try and fight it without a lawyer

not really... If I pay a lawyer I loose at least $250

If I dont fight it I have to pay $105 regaurdless

if I fight it an loose... oh well all it cost me was an extra couple hours of my life... cause I still have to pay $105

If I fight it myself and win... then I pay nothing and it cost me nothing... well other than time...

[choollaBard]

interesting lesson I learned as a teenager and have never forgotten. the other thing I took away from it is there really is nothing more despicable than a judge who does not care about justice, or policeman who lack honesty.

dont forget the City Prosecutor that lies and cheats... [yes]

[pavelChe]

If I fight it myself and win... then I pay nothing and it cost me nothing... well other than time...

Yes, but it also would pave the way to having the law rewritten or amended. Plus the courts may have to deal with other people that have been fined under the same law for the same reason.

[MannoFr]

This was too long too read, but if you did it and you want to get off on a technicality then you needed a lawyer a while ago. You are not smarter than a judge and you will just get yourself into more trouble.

If you didn't do it and it's a complicated process to prove that then you needed a lawyer a while ago. You are not smarter than a judge and you will just get yourself into more trouble.

troo dat

smashed_99cbr they are going to **** all over you bud and you'll come out of court with a higher conviction !

[M1iFiNmC]

troo dat



they are going to **** all over you bud and you'll come out of court with a higher conviction !

He's already been and didn't get off with it.