[BuyCheapest]

We all know how there has been a lot of fuzz how FIA is making sure Hamilton will win the championship no matter what, biggest reason being probably the good PR (Rookie, first black driver, no F1 champions in GB for a while) it would give.

Many just ignored it all, saying it's just envying people trying to make Hamilton look bad, but there's some new incidents which raise few more questions.

First one is Heikki Kovalainen, during safety car, he was told to keep longer distance to Hamilton (he was trying to get a good spot so he could try to overtake him after the safety car gets off the track) - and a bit later, told on the radio that "what ever you do, do not pass hamilton".
Sadly, I don't have any international sources for this, but it was reported by Heikki Kulta, who has very, very good reputation as F1 reporter around the F1 world, and has been in the F1 reporting business for 25+ years now.

The 2nd one is related to a YouTube video - FOM requested YouTube to remove a video from Fuji race from their site, and they did.
In the video, you could see Hamilton "soloing" behind the safety car, and ultimately, causing at least partly the Vettel-Webber crash.
This is the first (as far as I know) video EVER that FOM has requested YouTube to remove, as you know it's full of F1 videos.

Luckily, there has been people making copies of the video and keep uploading them to YouTube too, here's one:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_QJurnfxRm4

In the video, you can clearly see that Hamilton was not driving like he should (behind safety car, you should keep in clear line and within 5 car-lengths from the safety car), and causing the accident - Webber was forced to suddenly slow down, which caused Vettel to crash to him, or he would have gotten penalized for passing Hamilton behind the safety car.

[nebrarlepleme]

lol, i think you've gone over the edge.

[shkarpet$]

It certainly is possible that the FIA are grooming Hamilton for World Champion, he's all the things people expect from a world champion, and he attracts the American TV viewers. But saying that he certainly is good enough to win it alone with a good enough team and car behind him. Luck also plays a huge part as you can see looking at Ferrari's season. As for the email, the FIA can prove when they sent it (the opposite is not as easy to prove). It's not like Ferrari were left out purposely.

When you're talking about the radio messages, when was the order not to overtake given, during or after the safety car period? During the safety car it's a great order, after the safety car it's a little optimistic.

As for Vettle hitting Webber, that was a accident. It's not like Hamilton slowed down just to piss off Redbull Racing. If you were talking about a F1 veteran I could see your point, but this is his first season.

[BuyCheapest]

It certainly is possible that the FIA are grooming Hamilton for World Champion, he's all the things people expect from a world champion, and he attracts the American TV viewers. But saying that he certainly is good enough to win it alone with a good enough team and car behind him. Luck also plays a huge part as you can see looking at Ferrari's season. As for the email, the FIA can prove when they sent it (the opposite is not as easy to prove). It's not like Ferrari were left out purposely.

If FIA could or have proven they sent it in time etc, why did they apologize to Ferrari and changed their ways to deliver messages on paper too from now on?
When you're talking about the radio messages, when was the order not to overtake given, during or after the safety car period? During the safety car it's a great order, after the safety car it's a little optimistic. During safety car, no-one would give such order, everyone knows it's forbidden to overtake during safety car - the order was given apparently shortly after the first order - to keep more distance to Hamilton.

As for Vettle hitting Webber, that was a accident. It's not like Hamilton slowed down just to piss off Redbull Racing. If you were talking about a F1 veteran I could see your point, but this is his first season. He was breaking the rules with the way he drove and slowed down:
http://www.formula1.com/inside_f1/ru.../5251/fia.html
Read 40.7 and 40.8


Oh - and yes, i know Hamilton is a great driver, not trying to deny that.

[viagsjicguara]

oh come on. he stayed a similar distance behind the safety car the whole time. its not his fault vettel drove into the back of webber. no one is forcing vettel to ever be that close or directly behind webber are they? your just bitter its over for raikonnen.

[BuyCheapest]

oh come on. he stayed a similar distance behind the safety car the whole time. its not his fault vettel drove into the back of webber. no one is forcing vettel to ever be that close or directly behind webber are they? your just bitter its over for raikonnen.

Hint: 0.00-0.05 - he's quite close, well within the 5 car lengths rule.
0.05-0.08 - he goes REALLY slow in almost 90 degrees angle compared to the safety car - the difference @ 0.08 is probably well over 10 car lengths
0.08-0.09 - Webber has to unexpectedly break a lot due Hamilton driving REALLY slowly straight, when the actual track is going almost 90 degrees angle to left, he would have passed Hamilton without breaking > Vettel didn't expect this since according to rules you need to drive in line, calmly, no unexpected moves etc, behind the safety car, and hits Webber.

edit2: Showed the video to 4 people who don't follow really F1, but know what it is etc - also linked them the rules. One was finnish, 2 were danish, 1 was norwegian. Everyone agreed, that the car followed by camera (Hamilton) wasn't driving by the rules - he ended up too far, slowed down too much and driver erraticly

[goldeneggs]

Wow, first time I've seen that video, and as much as I love Hamilton's driving style, what he did there was incredibly stupid. He might not be completely to blame for the accident, but he should be penalised for dangerous driving behind the safety car. It definitely seemed like he was retiring from the race.

From what I saw on the TV I thought he was somewhat borderline clever/wrong in keeping the other drivers edgy by slowing down and speeding up somewhat randomly. But at least he did that on the racing line where it would be clear what he was doing.

And concerning the conspiracy, I think drivers always get reminders about rules. I'm sure I've even heard radio communication to the veteran Coulthard about simple rules or routine things, better safe than sorry I guess. Though I must admit the request to take down the youtube vid, if true, does seem a little strange; I can't think of a legitimate reason for them wanting to remove it.

[shkarpet$]

Whatever machine the email was sent from would have recorded a time. The chances are it was sent out at exactly the same time as the other emails. It is possible for a email to be delayed however, as depending on the address it could take any number of strange routes before it got to the address.
Have you never waited 10 minutes for an automated email? The reason for the FIA to go back to written notices is that they'll have proof of when it was sent AND when it was received. If Ferrari did indeed use the fact that the FIA couldn't prove when they got the email to their advantage then the FIA would make sure it could not happen again, if the email was genuinely an hour late then the FIA has taken step to make sure it doesn't happen again.
Either way the FIA can't prove a case against Ferrari without accusing them and inspecting their computers, so it's easier to give them the benefit of the doubt and not make a huge fuss over it.


As for the radio message I can't really comment without proof, but hypothetically I'll admit it does sound bad. If anything, it was probably to make sure Bennetton racing would not get in the way of the championship battle, a bad overtaking manuvuer that caused Hamilton to crash out would be seen as very bad PR, way too many people watching for that to happen to a major brand name like Benneton. Hamilton had already survived one incident, if he'd been hit twice in one race it would defiantly look like Bennetton was part of a conspiracy to stop a black man from winning the championship, and they'd never get to keep their united colours tag after that fiasco. I'm pretty sure all teams are going to be avoiding touching Hamilton's car for that same reason, as public opinion effects sponsorship deals.

Like I said Hamilton is a rookie, I don't know why he slowed down like that. But when it comes down to it poor Webber was stuck in a rookie sandwich and **** happened. He did his part as a experienced driver and didn't see Hamilton as being in the wrong. Insurance companies would see the crash as Vettles fault too, no matter how hard the person in front breaks the person behind should have enough room and be paying enough attention to break in time too.

I hope I've not bored you by writing too much, I do agree that the FIA do want Hamilton as next world champion as it could pull the US into the viewing figures and bring a lot of money in the sport. If by warning the also rans not to crash into him they aren't playing by your rules of honour I can accept that, but it's probably best for those teams not to let it happen.

[RSAccountssy]

As for the radio message I can't really comment without proof, but hypothetically I'll admit it does sound bad. If anything, it was probably to make sure Bennetton racing would not get in the way of the championship battle, a bad overtaking manuvuer that caused Hamilton to crash out would be seen as very bad PR, way too many people watching for that to happen to a major brand name like Benneton. Hamilton had already survived one incident, if he'd been hit twice in one race it would defiantly look like Bennetton was part of a conspiracy to stop a black man from winning the championship, and they'd never get to keep their united colours tag after that fiasco. I'm pretty sure all teams are going to be avoiding touching Hamilton's car for that same reason, as public opinion effects sponsorship deals.

It's not Benetton, it's Renault. It hasn't been Benetton for years.

[GOLAGLULT]

The distance between Hamilton and the safety car did not contribute to the accident, regardless of whether he was too close or not.

What caused the accident was the fact that he took a wide line through that corner (which he was perfectly able to do at his discretion), which distracted Vettle, who was too busy looking at Hamilton to watch where he was going, and promptly crashed into Webber.

It's like ppl rubbernecking at an accident on the motorway and causing an accident themselves. Happens all the time, but professional drivers should be wiser than that, and always be aware of their surroundings and the dangers within. Vettle was not, and he suffered the consequences.

I mean what if it wasn't Hamilton going wide that distracted him, what if it was someone waving in the crowd? Should he be banned from coming to future GPs? No, because he did nothing wrong, just like Hamilton didn't. Again, the distance he was from the safety car is a separate issue, and this accident could have happened even if he was at the correct distance.

[viagsjicguara]

ok, so he got close to the safety car so then backed off a bit. the easiest way to back off without slowing down too much is to take a wider and longer racing line.

its a tricky situation, but what i see is vettel driving into the back of webber. hamilton is on the other side of the track. he didnt force webber into breaking too hard. it was just vettel not looking at where webber was. you can see in the video it looks like vettel never even started to break. its unfortunate for webber but not really hamiltons fault.

[shkarpet$]

It's not Benetton, it's Renault. It hasn't been Benetton for years.

Ouch my bad, but you know what I'm trying to say. No one wants to get involved more than they need to.

[GOLAGLULT]

ok, so he got close to the safety car so then backed off a bit. the easiest way to back off without slowing down too much is to take a wider and longer racing line.

its a tricky situation, but what i see is vettel driving into the back of webber. hamilton is on the other side of the track. he didnt force webber into breaking too hard. it was just vettel not looking at where webber was. you can see in the video it looks like vettel never even started to break. its unfortunate for webber but not really hamiltons fault.

He even admitted himself in an interview that he was "distracted by Hamilton" and didn't see Webber infront of him

[BuyCheapest]

The distance between Hamilton and the safety car did not contribute to the accident, regardless of whether he was too close or not.

Too close? Hamilton let the safety car go too FAR, the limit is 5 car lengths (until the safety car starts to enter pits), and you need to drive in line behind it, not go crawling around every corner as far as you can
What caused the accident was the fact that he took a wide line through that corner (which he was perfectly able to do at his discretion), which distracted Vettle, who was too busy looking at Hamilton to watch where he was going, and promptly crashed into Webber. That's far from "taking a wide line" - he went practicly to full stop there and way out of the usual lines, even if you talk about wide lines.

It's like ppl rubbernecking at an accident on the motorway and causing an accident themselves. Happens all the time, but professional drivers should be wiser than that, and always be aware of their surroundings and the dangers within. Vettle was not, and he suffered the consequences.

I mean what if it wasn't Hamilton going wide that distracted him, what if it was someone waving in the crowd? Should he be banned from coming to future GPs? No, because he did nothing wrong, just like Hamilton didn't. Again, the distance he was from the safety car is a separate issue, and this accident could have happened even if he was at the correct distance. ¨
It's irrelevant if Vettel got distracted, there's nothing wrong with him getting penalized (too), but the problem is that Hamilton drove against the rules, which caused Webber to brake which caused Vettel to crash to him

[GOLAGLULT]

you need to drive in line behind it, not go crawling around every corner as far as you can

He NEEDS to does he now? Are you quoting from F1 regulations or is that your opinion?

That's far from "taking a wide line" - he went practicly to full stop there and way out of the usual lines, even if you talk about wide lines.

Again, you are allowd to speed up and slow down, drivers do it all the time. Which rule was he actually breaking?

It's irrelevant if Vettel got distracted, there's nothing wrong with him getting penalized (too), but the problem is that Hamilton drove against the rules, which caused Webber to brake which caused Vettel to crash to him

OH NOES! He braked? I thought they just drove round at constant speed for 70 laps. If the car infront brakes, you brake too. Unless ofcourse your eyes were elsewhere and you were driving FAR too close to the car infront...

[viagsjicguara]

Too close? Hamilton let the safety car go too FAR, the limit is 5 car lengths (until the safety car starts to enter pits), and you need to drive in line behind it, not go crawling around every corner as far as you can

That's far from "taking a wide line" - he went practicly to full stop there and way out of the usual lines, even if you talk about wide lines.


¨
It's irrelevant if Vettel got distracted, there's nothing wrong with him getting penalized (too), but the problem is that Hamilton drove against the rules, which caused Webber to brake which caused Vettel to crash to him

webber had to break? oh noes. everyone has to break, it was on a an s-bend. its 100% vettels fault because he drove into the back of webber. if he cant slow down he should give himself more of a gap.

[GOLAGLULT]

webber had to break? oh noes. everyone has to break, it was on a an s-bend. its 100% vettels fault because he drove into the back of webber. if he cant slow down he should give himself more of a gap.

What is it that they say about great minds again? [yes]

[HilaryNidierer]

i am confused now? can anyone post more write up and clip on the incident... is this a growing view or is nobody willing to stake on this?

[viagsjicguara]

What is it that they say about great minds again? [yes]

haha thats almost scarey. i didnt bother with the caps lock though.

it might have been different if it was down a straight, but it was in a very slow part of the track, and vettel wasnt even close to stopping.

[BuyCheapest]

He NEEDS to does he now? Are you quoting from F1 regulations or is that your opinion?

Regulations, like I already pasted earlier:
40.8 All competing cars must then form up in line behind the safety car no more than 5 car lengths apart
Line up
40.7 Any car being driven unnecessarily slowly, erratically or which is deemed potentially dangerous to other drivers at any time whilst the safety car is deployed will be reported to the stewards. This will apply whether any such car is being driven on the track, the pit entry or the pit lane.
No erratic moves like that

Again, you are allowd to speed up and slow down, drivers do it all the time. Which rule was he actually breaking? Speed up and slow down, yes, taking car next to full stop way, way off the lines and lot, lot further than 5 car lengths from safety car, no.


OH NOES! He braked? I thought they just drove round at constant speed for 70 laps. If the car infront brakes, you brake too. Unless ofcourse your eyes were elsewhere and you were driving FAR too close to the car infront... Brake into a corner and bring car next to a full stop so you wouldn't overtake another which just took his car next to a full stop way off the driving lines - and the line behind the safety car - are two different things