[ñàéäèíã]

The transit workers are merely one facet of the overall issue; the courts in the 1940s and 1950s in the US should NEVER have allowed public workers to form unions.

City governments are service providers, NOT job providers.

If you do not like purchasing a car from a unionized car company, you have a choice - with basic city services like schools, transit, police, etc - there is NO choice, you MUST deal with the product offered.

Further, municpalities have a fundamental responsibility to provide these services at the lowest possible cost, i.e, keeping taxes low - and thereby preventing corruption. Anything that raises the costs of providing these services is unacceptable, and that includes unions.

The Government here in the UK have in recent years threatened to take the 'right to strike' away from certain public services such as Prison Officers and the Fire Service.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/7175503.stm

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukne...-striking.html

Whilst UK Police do not have the 'right to strike' and are represented by a Federation rather than a Union.

Legislation was enacted in the aftermath of the 1919 Police Strikes, forbidding British Police from both taking industrial action, and discussing the possibility with colleagues. The Police Federation which was created at the time to deal with employment grievances, and provide representation to police officers, has increasingly put pressure on the government, and repeatedly threatened strike action, and has even carried out votes to try to change this legislation to give officers back the right to strike, but to no avail.

Obviously strikes by emergency services are particuarly controversial as they can lead to peoples lives being put at risk.

[Caliwany]

He picked the wrong fight. When the starting salary is squat, 4% a year means very little.

The things that should be looked into are salary caps for certain professions (such as no matter how long you have been a station cleaner, you should never make more than, say, $50K?) I will not make the levels as I do not know the responsibilities, but suffice to say, there is only so much "experience" you can get in some professions and having 20 years of experience does not make you any more valuable than someone with 10.

The other key is proviosions. If someone stinks, they should be let go. A janitor that does not cleanin up after the inconsiderate louts at some stations that cannot walk 2 feet to the nearest trash recepticle should not be one that we really feel the need to keep, especially when there are others looking for work (although most would probably not like his assignment either...)

The main problem is that, like schools, it is a political arrangement. The best conductors, the most understandable and clear announcers and the hardest working janitors will not be the ones getting the nicest stations or the best routes if they do not know how to kiss the right butts. A removal of this union protection will not do more than give us a bunch of overpaid relations and other people that know those in charge better than they know what they are being hired to do.

So the key point here RS is stop pointing out all these people that you want to burn on high in a bonfire to the gods and start talking like someone with a few lessbourbons coursing through his typing fingers.

You may be as sober and as rational as the rock of Gibraltar (really, it is a really rational rock!), but you sure as hell aren't coming off like it.

One final thing. We do not know you, we know Loft. We know when he is being ascerbic and when he is just trying to lighten things up from a poster intent of flaming. 22,000 posts and contributions across the entire site has a tendency to make people more likely to support you in a conflict than someon coming in and yelling at 17.

Oh, BTW, there is one other thing that comes with age that is nothing to brag about when posting about rationality. So can the "I am old, I know best" crap. Age is no benefit if you do not use what it gives you wisely. Crankiness has never been an asset. (although it does, arguably, make you a better arse.)

[DoctorDulitlBest]

Besides, I'm older (and crankier) than most here so that argument don't fly.

[Ruidselisse]

Have you tried Fiber?

/me hands Metamucil......

[chuecalovers]

Assuming that's ^ not aimed towards me ...

Wasn't aware that a high fiber diet calmed those anti-union blues

[Unakjyfk]

Death to Irregularity

[TaxSheemaSter]

Assuming that's ^ not aimed towards me ...

Wasn't aware that a high fiber diet calmed those anti-union blues

It just makes any blockage pass easier.

[LClan439]

I actually kinda agree with the guy. Not that I wish death on the workers, but my first thought too was to fire 11.5% of them. Then I calmed down.

I think the city should fire the bottom 10% of its workforce every few years.

[bZEUWO4F]

I am wondering what a transit worker is and why people wished they were dead.Do you really wish they were dead? please clarify.

[Madjostok]

They drive the cattle cars.

[TubOppomo]

I am wondering what a transit worker is and why people wished they were dead.Do you really wish they were dead? please clarify.

They are the staff (bus, subway, rail) of the Metropolitan Transit Authority. I don't think anyone really wants them dead. The title of the thread is rhetorical -- "Death to the Transit Workers Union". The issue is that this labor union recently negotiated a deal for a pay raise for the workers it represents and some people are upset about the terms of the new proposed (?) contract. Others here can elaborate on the details.

[stastony]

I think the MTA should follow the example of the private sector. Cut salaries across the board by 10%, ALL THE WAY UP THE LINE!

Start with the executives.

THEN protest Albany to do the same for ALL state workers and representatives. Lead by example.

If that does not work, they then need to find a way to keep the $$ in the city rather than paying for the entire states shortcomings.

But the key is everyone, not just the peons.

One exec getting a cut can pay for several underlings in full.

[HunterM]

The MTA should be re-organized, completely.

It's a dysfunctional agency.

[Herimoisige]

More fuel to the fire:

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/12/16/op...y.html?_r=1&hp


December 16, 2009
EDITORIAL
New York’s Fiscal Crisis

A Legislature in Denial

Gov. David Paterson of New York announced this week that the state will have to delay $750 million in scheduled payments to schools and local governments. It is a drastic step, but the governor, rightly, argues that he had no alternative. It was either that or watch the state slip $1 billion into the red.

Even to borrow that money, the governor and legislative leaders would have to declare a fiscal emergency before they could seek an expensive short-term loan. The Legislature, in denial, is refusing to do the hard work that’s needed.

Mr. Paterson has gone for a delay in the hopes that tax revenues next month will be a little higher than projected. There is no guarantee that Wall Street bonuses or first signs of recovery will bring in enough cash to make it through to the end of the fiscal year in March.

Unless there are serious changes in the way New York spends and raises money, the state could be facing a $10 billion deficit next year.

New York is not alone in facing tough times. But for years, New York’s Legislature has been spending beyond its means. The recession has made matters far worse. Mr. Paterson, who took office just as Bear Stearns collapsed in 2008, has been warning of calamity ever since. The Legislature has stubbornly refused to listen.

Last month, the governor called lawmakers back to Albany to fill a $3.2 billion gap in this year’s budget of $132 billion. The governor proposed painful cuts: including $113 million from the New York City-area public transit budget; $686 million in school funds, or about 3 percent per district with even larger cuts for wealthier districts; $470 million from health care spending.

The Democratic-majority Legislature balked. Lawmakers decreed there would be no midyear cuts in school budgets, not even for wealthy districts. Although they did improve the pension structure, legislators protected other programs like health care and shielded state workers from furloughs or layoffs.

They finally made some cuts, including a larger swipe at the Metropolitan Transportation Authority, but mostly they drained other savings accounts and used some of the federal stimulus dollars that were supposed to be saved for next year.

Even then, they only came up with $2.7 billion — and were $500 million short. That left Governor Paterson no choice but to delay payments to schools cities and towns. Some of these schools have rainy-day funds, but Mr. Paterson should try to limit cuts for the poorer areas. Communities will have no choice but to pare down spending.

Legislative leaders — from both parties — need to wake up to the harsh reality. When the stimulus money is gone there will be no cushion, and there is no hidden cache of funds about to be discovered.

There is no chance of balancing next year’s budget as required by law unless they are finally willing to make deep cuts, even in favorite programs, personal items to districts and especially those items backed by the state’s most powerful education unions, and health care and business lobbyists. At this point, there is no other choice.

Long Island's Fortress Mentality

There may be some dire situation in which state senators from Long Island will stop insisting that their disproportionate share of state school aid must not be cut, delayed or in any way changed. Don’t count on it.

Despite the serious disaster that has hit the state’s budget, the Long Island delegation has been behaving as it always has. They have opposed Gov. David Paterson’s repeated efforts to get New York’s finances in order, including his latest tactic of delaying $750 million in December payments, including aid to schools, to avoid insolvency this year. The naysayers include the usual Republican bloc, along with two newcomer Democrats with dicey re-election hopes, Craig Johnson and Brian Foley.

Greedy parochialism is old news in Nassau and Suffolk Counties. Turn back to any year — say, 1988, when this page was deploring how “a pork-minded bloc of Republican senators” known as “the Long Island Eight,” led by Ralph J. Marino of Muttontown, was holding a budget hostage over aid to local school districts.

The state’s convoluted school-aid formulas have long favored rich Long Island schools at the expense of those in New York City and other districts where people are poor and needs are great. Long Island has some of the highest-spending districts and best-paid superintendents in the country. It’s home to a district — Roslyn — where administrators, employees and their families stole millions of dollars for years, and nobody noticed.

This is not to say that Long Islanders are not feeling financial pain. They pay some of the highest property taxes in the country, and Mr. Johnson and Mr. Foley have good reason to be afraid of wrathful voters, who just fired the able Nassau County executive, Thomas Suozzi, because they were sick of paying high taxes.

But Long Islanders have proudly embraced their ever-more-expensive schools for years, approving ever-higher budgets and ever-soaring official salaries. For years they have benefited from the powerful bloc voting of their Senate delegation. It’s ridiculous to think their schools can’t possibly tap rainy-day funds or find savings on an island where superintendents routinely make six figures, where some rich villages give students two identical textbooks — one for home and one for school — and where the sports and arts and video and language programs are the envy of the nation.

New York is in dire straits, the governor is trying to cope and Long Island’s schools are touchable.

-----------

It is time to liquidate the unions, and restructure public employee contracts, pensions and benefits across the entire state.

Health payments and medicaid MUST be reduced so as to be more in line with the rest of the country.

Disband the entire state assembly and senate, and replace them with full-time officials without external jobs that create massive conflicts of interest, like with criminals such as Bruno.

Then consolidate school districts so as to eliminate waste. There are so many more things that can also be done...

[bonyrek]

More fuel to the fire:

Disband the entire state assembly and senate, and replace them with full-time officials without external jobs that create massive conflicts of interest, like with criminals such as Bruno.

Then consolidate school districts so as to eliminate waste. There are so many more things that can also be done...

Was not your main contention that it is liberal democrats that are bankrupting this city (as you say they did in the 70s) and it is essentially a change of party leadership that is needed; if so, why site Bruno - he is a Republican.


p.s. - There is only one set of simple rule here: not two. There is no censorship on WNY!

[KneefeZes]

Disband the entire state assembly and senate, and replace them with full-time officials without external jobs that create massive conflicts of interest, like with criminals such as Bruno.

Interesting objective.

How would you go about disbanding the NYS Legislature?

Maybe your Iran plan would transfer to Albany ...

Nihilism It's so twentieth century.

[Xavier_Spinner_Wheels]

Was not your main contention that it is liberal democrats that are bankrupting this city (as you say they did in the 70s) and it is essentially a change of party leadership that is needed; if so, why site Bruno - he is a Republican.

Where did i claim that republicans bear no responsibility? Repubs like Bruno are RINOs, they are free-spending liberals who pretend to be repubs.

This is not a question of party, anyone with a brain knows that the union pensions and benefits are bankrupting the city and state, and for the NYT - whose existence in life it seems is to protect unions - to actually come out and admit they are damaging the financial health of the city is proof positive of the need for change.

The repubs in NYS office are no better than the dems, and all should be removed from office, with full timers voted in so that they cannot claim they "need external income" to survive. The conflicts of interest displayed by scum like Bruno, where he runs a consulting company that makes money off of those who have business before the state is totally unacceptable, and he is not the only turd doing this.

How anyone can believe filth like Espada and Monserratte should be anywhere near public office at this point is beyond the pale.

Side note: given that it seems that i am the only conservative here, either the liberals have taken over the former, or the mods do not manage the forum fairly...which is it?

[Feflyinvelf]

Do you need an avatar?

[FoetAgerhot46]

... it seems that i am the only conservative here, either the liberals have taken over the former, or the mods do not manage the forum fairly...which is it?

Why would the lack of an intelligent conservative POV (is that an oxymoron in this day and age?) indicate unfair management by mods?

Seems there's an implication that those who moderate here censor views that are not line with some imagined agenda.

Far from the truth.

Historically at WNY the "conservative" voices tend to repeat and bleat to such a degree that there's little to no engagement -- they often hang around for a while, scream their guts out then wither and die of their own accord.

[HakTaisanip]

How anyone can believe filth like Espada and Monserratte should be anywhere near public office at this point is beyond the pale.

Side note: given that it seems that i am the only conservative here, either the liberals have taken over the former, or the mods do not manage the forum fairly...which is it?

O.K. – you’re the rhodescholar here, and the truth of what you say is just to obvious to deny; but I honestly do not know why there are not more conservative voices on these forums.

This being a NYC centric website, one would expect the membership to be predominately liberal where politics are concerned. I personally would not consider myself liberal, left-of-center maybe: but definitely not a liberal.

That being said, maybe you can balance things out around here a bit; to me the only bad post, is no post. And if you are in fact a Rhodescholar: all the better.

And yea., Espada/Monserratte – the worst.