[GillTeepbew]

They get charged with rape, assault, etc. If someone breaks into your house and rapes you they're going to be charged with rape and that's all anyone is going to care about.

This statement is correct.

That chart is old and useless. In 1997 there was a different mindset. The stats from 1997 vs. today might actually surprise many.

http://www.disastercenter.com/crime/nycrime.htm

http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/murd...ally-and-state

Crime rates are actually going down

[Rqqneujr]

It's not the kind of slippery slope you want to go down. With every subsequent politician, those "reasonable" limits would go down. You don't need to ban guns to ban guns. You can just regulate them out of existence.

That argument is a little frivolous as it can basically apply to anything.

Let's not regulate anything because it might lead to an eventual ban then ?

People have trouble following traffic rules and get into accidents that kill tens of thousands each year. Yet we don't ban driving or owning a car.

Cars are not devices whose primary use is to hurt and kill.

I never said that guns should be banned, I am not for the outright banning of guns.

That would be madness in a country with such an affinity for them.

However, if you look at the number of legal gun owners convicted for a violent crime that they used their legal gun for, that number is actually laughably small.

I just mentioned that to counter the claim you made that legal guns are widely used to thwart crime safely.

If they are used to foil tens of thousands of crimes, legal guns are also used in thousands of suicides and accidents.

[Arrocousa]

That chart is old and useless. In 1997 there was a different mindset. The stats from 1997 vs. today might actually surprise many.

http://www.disastercenter.com/crime/nycrime.htm

http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/murd...ally-and-state

Crime rates are actually going down

Yes, there's probably newer more useful data but the fact that crime is going down has nothing to do with gun ownership.

[jojocomok]

Yes, there's probably newer more useful data but the fact that crime is going down has nothing to do with gun ownership.

That is one hell of a blanket statement with nothing to back it up!

Unfortunately, for every reponsible gun owner, there'll be an idiot - any of you guys that own firearms ever leave a weapon in the glovebox of your car? Have you ever 'lost' one?

As a couple of amusing examples of bad owners demonstrate, even legal owners can be stupid - one guy thinking there was an intruder in the room, at the end of the bed, shot his foot and another, as the story went, had a similar accident with an erection - if true, I guess Darwinism was working that night. I hate to think how many stupid accidents, injuries and fatalities have arisen by mixing alcohol and unsecured firearms.

However, as I don't seem to drink, I'd definitely prefer the option of having something and not needing it, than needing and not having one!

[Rnlvifov]

That is one hell of a blanket statement with nothing to back it up!

It's not.


There isn't any evidence linking gun ownership to lower crime rates.

Read this

http://pricetheory.uchicago.edu/levi...yCrime2004.pdf

[MicoSiru]

Cars are not devices whose primary use is to hurt and kill.

I may be a bit off on my statistics, since I haven't researched them in a while, but last I heard there were actually more firearms in the u.s. than automobiles. So why is it that a device whose primary use is NOT to hurt people is killing more people when there are fewer of them in the U.S.? If guns are for killing, and cars aren't, you'd expect having a greater number of guns would mean a whole lot more firearm related deaths than automobile related deaths.

The last time I saw someone make that argument was probably a couple years back. They linked statistics showing that vehicles killed something like 40,000 people and guns only killed around 10,000.

[wantedLOX]

The last time I saw someone make that argument was probably a couple years back. They linked statistics showing that vehicles killed something like 40,000 people and guns only killed around 10,000.

What do drive-bys count as? [rofl]

[Fededorbprago]

I may be a bit off on my statistics, since I haven't researched them in a while, but last I heard there were actually more firearms in the u.s. than automobiles. So why is it that a device whose primary use is NOT to hurt people is killing more people when there are fewer of them in the U.S.? If guns are for killing, and cars aren't, you'd expect having a greater number of guns would mean a whole lot more firearm related deaths than automobile related deaths.

The last time I saw someone make that argument was probably a couple years back. They linked statistics showing that vehicles killed something like 40,000 people and guns only killed around 10,000.

What do you think is used more daily ? Guns or cars ?

[gregmcal]

What about the rates of knife (or edged weapons) deaths - legal or illegal? I expect they've dropped a fair bit over the last 30 years or so?

[metrocartockasur]

What about the rates of knife (or edged weapons) deaths - legal or illegal? I expect they've dropped a fair bit over the last 30 years or so?

What about them ?

[HootSnori]

What about them ?

They're in everyday use and also used in homicides and for protection but no-one seems concerned about their being out there...

[edit] This is a partial windup, as well as a serious inquiry - just in case you didn"t realise

[ggandibazz]

They're in everyday use and also used in homicides and for protection but no-one seems concerned about their being out there...

[edit] This is a partial windup, as well as a serious inquiry - just in case you didn"t realise

You'd be surprised. A couple of years ago I heard that some assheads were promoting the idea that pointy knives should be banned in the UK altogether, including kitchen ones.

And certainly tons of places limit knife carry. Cause of course... that decreases knife crime.

I think maybe we should go all the way, and prohibit martial arts, sticks, stones, anything heavy that isn't nailed down, glass, and hands.

[arcaniagainee]

You'd be surprised. A couple of years ago I heard that some assheads were promoting the idea that pointy knives should be banned in the UK altogether, including kitchen ones.

And certainly tons of places limit knife carry. Cause of course... that decreases knife crime.

I think maybe we should go all the way, and prohibit martial arts, sticks, stones, anything heavy that isn't nailed down, glass, and hands.

If you do that, you won't hear about stabbings anymore because everyone will be talking about the recent spoonings. [rofl]

[ZenDers]

They're in everyday use and also used in homicides and for protection but no-one seems concerned about their being out there...

[edit] This is a partial windup, as well as a serious inquiry - just in case you didn"t realise

I saw a little jest but seriously, that argument is old and tired.

And no, a knife and a gun are not comparable.