[AngelBee]

Asalam Alikum

I was just curios to know, what does an alim do after graduation? Do they continue with religious studies? Do they go on to secular studies? Imam? Teacher? Unemployed?

I know there are alot of possibilities and that everyone will be answering what they think. But it would be BEST if ulama who have graduate answer. I would like to know what various brothers are doing after completing the alim course and the ones who are currently studying, what they plan to do? And how to they plan to earn a living?

Please ulama reply with your experiences.

JazakAllah

[Wheegiabe]

Some go into teaching, some become imāms, some become authors/translators, some continue studying, some become professionals etc..

Unfortunately many ʿālim course graduates in the UK do not make good use of their qualifications. There are countless ʿālim and muftī course graduates out there, but only few actually put their skills to full use to benefit the Muslims.

For example, what is the point of becoming a muftī if you do not use your qualifications in any way and instead pursue a full-time professional career?

Every graduate of a madrasah should be mindful of his duty towards the Muslims in terms of spreading knowledge, educating the young/new Muslims, etc..

Unfortunately the huge potential of our madāris and their graduates is not put to use and not properly channelled. Countries like Germany, France, Italy, Spain, etc. urgently need scholars and authentic educational programs, so why not encourage young ʿālim course graduates to go out in "teaching jamaats" and stay for a few months in these countries to educate local Muslims about classical Islām? Thereby they could improve their teaching skills, increase the connection amongst European Muslims and also gain huge rewards.

What is opinion of ʿulamā like abuhajira, SaeedM, UmHasan, sudoku, etc. on this "teaching jamaat" idea?

Any suggestions about how to practically pursue this idea?

[pKgGpUlF]

on this "teaching jamaat" idea?

the proposal needs to come from local areas.

[Wheegiabe]

the proposal needs to come from local areas.

Please elaborate.

[pKgGpUlF]

Please elaborate.

like your local masjid people arranges all the facilities, and then hire any ulama for few months to teach them there.

masjid comitte needs to gather the people who wanna study and also arrange place where the teacer can stay for those months.

[CaseyFronczekHomie]

I would like to know what initial difficulties or problems do graduates fresh out of the Madrassa/Darul Uloom usually face? Maybe our Ulema on board can shed some light on this and explain how they've overcome these obstacles themselves? Or what are the right steps to take for such a young 'Alim at the beginning of his "new life"?

[pKgGpUlF]

yeah, because bro faruqi and TQ gotta face it soon mashaAllah

[NKUDirectory]

What is opinion of ʿulamā like abuhajira, SaeedM, UmHasan, sudoku, etc. on this "teaching jamaat" idea?

Although I am just a jaahilah (never managed to finish my studies) but I think the idea is a very good one and should be implimented. One way could be to add this on as practicals from the school side. So each year graduates are made into different groups and sent to different locations along with a seasoned 'aalim, like in TJ, however they stay for more than three days, like at least two weeks or so, and have courses etc. However as br abulayl mentioned, there will need to be some aid from the locality where the new 'ulama will stay.

[Marlboro-oroblraM]

They could benefit Muslims by doing research and writing books on important topics (including translating existing works and writing commentaries). What the 'ulema used to do in the old days.

[WeestDype]

They could benefit Muslims by doing research and writing books on important topics (including translating existing works and writing commentaries). What the 'ulema used to do in the old days.

Who will feed them while they benefit the Muslims?

[Marlboro-oroblraM]

Who will feed them while they benefit the Muslims?

Who fed them while they were in madrassah?

[PefeFoesk]

Assalaamu 'alaykum
The following is my two pence worth which i take the liberty to add here due to our family experience of having young graduates with enthusiasm and the fikr (concern) to impart the knowledge bestowed upon them. They have had to search for suitable posts so as not go into ordinary jobs/professions where there would be less chances of progressing in knowledge or deeni khidmat.

@brothers Abu Tamim and Dhul Qarnain: Allah subhaanahu wat'ala is the Raaziq but effort on our part is necessary and they will have to earn a basic living so as not to rely on handouts.

@Brother Al Faaruqi: Its a very good idea for those young 'Aalims who are unable to find work which involves Deeni khidmat and which will increase their knowledge, however it would cost to travel and stay in any European country which would be a major obstacle.

[Blotassefesek]

Unfortunately many ʿālim course graduates in the UK do not make good use of their qualifications. There are countless ʿālim and muftī course graduates out there, but only few actually put their skills to full use to benefit the Muslims.

For example, what is the point of becoming a muftī if you do not use your qualifications in any way and instead pursue a full-time professional career?

Every graduate of a madrasah should be mindful of his duty towards the Muslims in terms of spreading knowledge, educating the young/new Muslims, etc..

Unfortunately the huge potential of our madāris and their graduates is not put to use and not properly channelled.

Salam,

You are correct brother in what you say. However, the people really at blame are the muslim communities. Many of my friends are graduates of madaris. The problem darul uloom graduates face after completing their studies is that many are willing to teach and get into work of deen.

The problem they are usually faced with though, after graduation they find that there is nothing for them in terms of help and support. They are left alone with no support from their communities. There is nothing in place to help ensure they are able to spend their time teaching. Instead what they find is that they have responsibilities and financial burdens. They have to earn money and support themselves and their families. Many of them are usually married of nearing the end of their studies or soon after.

There is no financial support. So they end up finding themselves having to work. When they begin working, teaching becomes difficult as teaching requires much in the way of research which is extremely time consuming. Working and teaching together is very challenging. Many find it difficult to cope.

Thus they end up working, leave the texts/books/mutoon they have studied then a 2-3 years down the line end up forgetting much. Some even forget much of the arabic and are not at that point even able to go back to the books to relearn them. Others find they do not have the time they need to devote to the texts to relearn them. This is a serious problem.

One of the maulana's I know, who after graduation was teaching in the masjid and gave a lecture every friday, only to find that hardly anyone turned up. The number of those attending were a mere 7-8 people. At time it was half that, once even no body turned up to listen to the bayan. Had it been a famous/popular speaker however, then watch the crowds that turn up.

Can you then blame these ulama? The question is, who is truly at fault here?

It is the communities. They cry and complain about not having young english speaking scholars, when they do have them they do not value them nor take benefit from them. Instead preferring to go for more popular speakers. It's truly a shame, but this is what I have been witnessing.

If the situation was different, the communities actually cared for the ulama, supported them financially, valued them and would come to take knowledge from them the situation may be far different. I think the communities need to get pull their socks up, get their priorities right and do what needs to be done.

It's like not long ago, on this very forum there was a thread about these courses at places like al maghrib institute and other salafi organizations who charge ridiculous amounts of money, extortionate rates and there was a brother on their whom I tried to advise that rather than people spend all that money on a weekend course, that's very simple to begin with and spend that same money on taking on a scholar who can teach in the locality properly. Where those who can not afford such courses could too then attend and benefit. What did he prefer instead? To stick with the ridiculously priced course.

Unfortunately we have our priorities all wrong. I truly feel for these graduates. All those years of study for what? Subhanallah. May Allah swt guide us, ameen.

wassalaam.

[PefeFoesk]

Salam,

However, the people really at blame are the muslim communities. .

Wa 'alykumus salaam
I have to disagree as most families in the "communities" are not wealthy enough to support these young graduates. Majority of the families of the graduates also are not wealthy enough to support them (their young wives and maybe even a child) so that they can devote themselves to khidmat of the community. They have to look far and wide for suitable positions. Many I know have moved to other places to take imaamat or teaching posts solely so that they dont have to take ordinary jobs.

[Blotassefesek]

Wa 'alykumus salaam
I have to disagree as most families in the "communities" are not wealthy enough to support these young graduates. Majority of the families of the graduates also are not wealthy enough to support them (their young wives and maybe even a child) so that they can devote themselves to khidmat of the community. They have to look far and wide for suitable positions. Many I know have moved to other places to take imaamat or teaching posts solely so that they dont have to take ordinary jobs.

Assalaamu alaykum,

With all due respect sister, I would strongly disagree that the community are unable to support the ulama. In my locality for example there are a number of masajid. Quite a few of which are recently built costing between £3-£5 million each. If in one town alone, people can afford such vast amounts of money, how can they not then support the ulama? It just defies reason. It makes no sense at all. Communities can raise vast amounts of money for a masjid, but can not raise even a fraction for an aalim?

Just look and see how money muslims nowadays are driving £25000-£50000 cars. In one muslim area, you can find many such expensive cars. Yes many are not wealthy, but at the same time there are many that are.

Where I live, there are something like 20-25 thousand muslims. Even if we took only a fraction of that number, are you suggesting that they are not capable of supporting the ulama? Let's do a little bit of simple calculation.

Let's say we have 200 people willing to contribute £2 each towards wages a week. That's already £400. Which is in my view about right for a scholar. Are you suggesting 200 people can not spare only £2 per week?

Imagine if had 1000 (still relatively a small number) will to donate £5 a week (not much at all, people spend far more just on confectionery alone, or smoking), that's £5000 a week towards wages for scholar and materials. How many scholar do you think we could employ with that. Let's say they spent £1000 a week on other costs and materials, that still leaves £4000. If we paid £400 per week per aalim, that's 10 scholars that could teach.

Is that really difficult? It is far far easier that what you are making it to be out sister. How many people can't spare just a few pounds per week?

You see sister, the problem is with the communities. Recently, the masjid I attend, they had some decorations done in the masjid, calliagraphy in the dome, boards with ayaat etc put up in etc. You know how much they spent on that? If I remember correctly (can't remember the exact figure) but it came to well over £100,000. They can spend that on decorations, but can not spare some money to pay ulama. It is completely shameful. I won't reveal where I am from as I don't want to embarrass the masjid. This is exactly what I mean when I say people have their priorities all wrong.

This is the harsh reality sister. If the communities pulled their resources together they could easily pay ulama a decent wage and still have plenty left over. It's far easier than people make it out be. The problem is, the hearts of the people is in the wrong place.

So I fully stand by what I said.

wallahu a'alam,
wassalaam.

[Knongargoapex]

Many I know have moved to other places to take imaamat or teaching posts solely so that they dont have to take ordinary jobs.

What is wrong with "ordinary jobs"; many sahaba had these ordinary jobs, doing business and what not.

[Knongargoapex]

Quite a few of which are recently built costing between £3-£5 million each. If in one town alone, people can afford such vast amounts of money, how can they not then support the ulama?

Just look and see how money muslims nowadays are driving £25000-£50000 cars. In one muslim area, you can find many such expensive cars. Yes many are not wealthy, but at the same time there are many that are.

You see sister, the problem is with the communities. Recently, the masjid I attend, they had some decorations done in the masjid, calliagraphy in the dome, boards with ayaat etc put up in etc. You know how much they spent on that? If I remember correctly (can't remember the exact figure) but it came to well over £100,000. They can spend that on decorations, but can spare the money to pay ulama. It is completely shameful. I won't reveal where I am from as I don't want to embarrass the masjid.

I posted on this forum several weeks ago this very same thing and several people were arguing for days that these costs are good and we must have good looking masajid, and have husn dhun about what kind of cars people driving; I agree with you these are waste of money.

[Knongargoapex]

It's like not long ago, on this very forum there was a thread about these courses at places like al maghrib institute and other salafi organizations who charge ridiculous amounts of money, extortionate rates and there was a brother on their whom I tried to advise that rather than people spend all that money on a weekend course, that's very simple to begin with and spend that same money on taking on a scholar who can teach in the locality properly. Where those who can not afford such courses could too then attend and benefit. What did he prefer instead? To stick with the ridiculously priced course.

wswrwb-

1. The average Muslim is dying of thirst for Islamic knowledge, and they will pay to get it from anyone who is qualified and presenting the material in timely way, convenient schedule and professionally done manner, no matter if you trying to divide us and put labels on them salafi or whatever. These shuyookh studied many years and you putting labels on them as if you know more than them. Do you have more knowledge than Yasir Qadhi, Muhammad al Shareef? Look on the almaghrib website biographies of instructors and compare that to the level of kowledge of anyone on reading this forum.

2. many of us are working are own jobs, trying to raise families in terrible environment of the west, dealing with kuffar day in and day out, and then you want us to go find a bunch or Muslims, find alim, tell him to make a course, wait for the course to develop, then teach ourselves and our kids that way instead of going ready made courses. Please, go do google search and lookup almaghrib courses they have.

When you want a pizza, do you go and get tomatoes, cheese, dough, and spend few hours cooking it, or do you go and buy pizza for extortion rates?

[Blotassefesek]

wswrwb-

1. The average Muslim is dying of thirst for Islamic knowledge, and they will pay to get it from anyone who is qualified and presenting the material in timely way, convenient schedule and professionally done manner, no matter if you trying to divide us and put labels on them salafi or whatever. These shuyookh studied many years and you putting labels on them as if you know more than them. Do you have more knowledge than Yasir Qadhi, Muhammad al Shareef? Look on the almaghrib website biographies of instructors and compare that to the level of kowledge of anyone on reading this forum.

2. many of us are working are own jobs, trying to raise families in terrible environment of the west, dealing with kuffar day in and day out, and then you want us to go find a bunch or Muslims, find alim, tell him to make a course, wait for the course to develop, then teach ourselves and our kids that way instead of going ready made courses. Please, go do google search and lookup almaghrib courses they have.

When you want a pizza, do you go and get tomatoes, cheese, dough, and spend few hours cooking it, or do you go and buy pizza for extortion rates?

Salam,

Brother, first of all, you should read up the sayings of the salaf and the classical ulama regarding the hukm of seeking knowledge and the conditions that scholars have to meet before you can take knowledge from them. There is much to mention on this topic and so I will not get into it.

Just because a person has spent years studying does not automatically mean that we should take knowledge from them. They have to meet certain conditions. Otherwise let's apply your reasoning to others, would you also take from shia scholars, scholars of the khawarij, mu'tazila etc if they had spent years studying? So your reasoning here is not valid. How long a person spent studying is not the only factor we consider.

As for your second point, with respect, I think you under estimate the capabilities of many of our ulama. I will give the same example I gave before in my local masjid. During ramadhan it was decided by the Imam (who is also a mufti) that there needs to be a course which covers the type of knowledge which is compulsory upon all muslims.

Within a period of only two weeks, they had a full 12 week course designed to teach aqeeda, fiqh and tajweed. The course i on going. In different phases. Each phase being 12 weeks. Students are examined and tested at the end of each phase. Then they progress on the second phase (level 2) and continue the subjects. The first phase is begun again for new students. When a subject is covered during any phase, for the next phase a new subject is introduced in it's stead. It is taught in the evenings on the weekend when people are free.

Alhamdulillah the course has been a success. The course was designed, put together, promoted, registration taken etc all in the period of only two weeks. It's not as complicated as you are making it out to be.

I have seen the al maghrib, kauthar etc courses. Alhamdulillah I have to say the course being run in our masjid is far far superior and better. The only thing that is slightly lacking is the presentation of the material which is a very minor issue, and was due to the short time frame in which it was put together. Those courses in those salafi institutes in comparison are seriously lacking. Every scholar I know that has looked at those courses have come to pretty much the same conclusion. That their courses are well presented, yet lacking in content and heavily over priced. The added advantage to the course in my masjid, since it is being taught over time (not rushed), students absorb the materials better, understand more, have more opportunities to ask questions, seek clarifications, revise the materials and retain it better. The way it is supposed to be done.

My question to you is, have you even attempted to find a scholar, ask him to teach and ask how long it would take to put together the needed courses? If not, then you are merely speculating. How are you able to judge what they are capable of or not?

Finding difficulty in locating a suitable scholar? Again not much of an issue. All you need to do is contact the few major madaris in the UK. Bury, blackburn etc. Contact them, explain what you are attempting to do and ask if they know of ulama in your area that could teach. More than likely they will know a graduate from their institution or will know of ulama who could point you in the right direction. All you need to do is employ your intelligence a little, and make the efforts.

But it's easy to speculate isn't it, sitting around and not making any efforts. Even if it does take time, so what? The benefit in the long run is far greater and better than resorting to these over priced institutions, quick courses (I will honestly be surprised if students even manage to retain a great deal, or they can be taught thoroughly in such a short period).

If you actually make the efforts, you will find that Allah swt will open doors for you and assist you. But if you sit around complaining, then how do you expect Allah swt do help you?

wallahu a'alam,
wassalaam.

Forgive me for sounding harsh if I did, but some things just need to be said.

wallahu a'alam,
wassalaam.

[Knongargoapex]

My question to you is, have you even attempted to find a scholar, ask him to teach and ask how long it would take to put together the needed courses? If not, then you are merely speculating. How are you able to judge what they are capable of or not?

wswrwb-

on time i went to scholar and asked him questions about something, he gave me his email and said email tohim. I did that and never heard back from him!