[attishina]

My boy barks at strangers. If he's inside- it's just a bark to let us know he hears someone outside.

But, when he is on his chain in the back yard & sees a stranger - he barks, pulls & will lunge towards the person. He shows no teeth, but when he is pulling on the chain it "looks" very aggerssive. But if the person were to come in the yard, talk 2 him & pick up a big stick, he would be happy 2 play.

My neighbor's dislike him very much for what he is- and I'm sure the way he acts on the chain only "confirms" how they feel. If they would ever be willing 2 meet him in the front, or the street- they would see he is a great dog, that has No desire to kill a person.

I'm not worried at all about my dogs behavior.

[bF8CCmmr]

So, I have opinions and I am usually not shy about airing them here. I try to be fair and I try to look at the big picture and I am human, so I will admit I must sometimes fail.

In Valerie's thread someone mentioned that they were concerned with Piper barking at random strangers. *lightbulb over my head lights* Hey, Rita barks at random strangers..*cast suspicious look at Rita* Hmmmm

I may be to close to the forest to see the trees...

Rita is very friendly on walks, very friendly when new people come in to my home. Likes other dogs, likes kids. First time she met my friend,R, he was shaking in his boots ("Holy shit! You got a WHAT?!?!?!? Why did you get a year old Pit Bull???) and she reacted by jumping right into his lap and licking the skin off his chin while wiggling and wagging.

However, she does bark at "random strangers" that come onto the street such as neighbors friends. Not the regular people, just the people that aren't part of the blocks normal routine. She goes to teh window or fence, looks out onto the street and will bark if theres something new going on. I tell her "Thank you! I see it." give her a pet and she goes about her day.

So, is this considered incorrect because she is supposed to like everyone all the time no matter what? Am I too blind to see something wrong with my own dog? I've never seen a problem with it and just thought she was being a dog, ya know? Ike, btw, never barks at anything unless he wants something or is playing.

[Averti$ingGuru]

I'm sure its nothing to worry about unless she was trying to get at the person with hackles up and teeth bared with obvious intent to harm that individual. Most dogs will bark to let you know that there is someone that isn't normally around.

[bF8CCmmr]

Nope, she just barks with no growling or teeth or hackles. I thought it was a perfectly normal dog thing, too, but I had to wonder after really thinking about the friendly at all times to people thing in the breed standard.

[KraskiNetu]

Well...I am also opinionated but I think I do a reasonable job of tempering my opinions with diplomacy. I keep in mind that because I am human and so is everyone else; it is virtually impossible to make an assessment over the internet...especially when talking about high risk behavior that could have any one of a thousand causes from the completely benign and workable to the truely problematic and unsolvable.

That said; I almost responded to the thread you mentioned.

Veronica does the same thing. If someone is afraid of her and gives off certain vibes; she has in some instances barked at them. Not an aggressive bark; but if left to her own devices she'd go right up in their face and bark so that her 2 front feet come off the ground. It's her "OMG! What's wrong? What's wrong?" bark. (It's only happened less than a handful of times and obviously I don't allow this and remove her). In one instance, I have to say the people she was barking at freaked me out too.

At other times she will find something about the random stranger that freaks her out and she will bark. If I can sense it before hand I will click/mark her and treat her and that works well. If she reacts before I do then I will re-direct her and tell her to be quiet. She's a very vocal dog; and certain things can freak her out a bit; also some inanimate objects. I've noticed she's gotten better as she's gotten older; but I think that's more due to my approach vs. maturity. I name objects for her, I tell her what they are, tell her not to worry, let her investigate at her own pace if possible, do allot of clicking and treating and allot of "watch me/leave it's".

Am I concerned about her temperment. Not at all. She's extremely people friendly and loves attention (I even had a behaviorist tell me I should put her in training to be a therapy dog). Do I think she has a "perfect temperment? No I don't. I think she does very well with me because I am so in tune to her and put so much time and effort into her training; but I kind of wonder how her temperment would have evolved had her life experiences been different and had training been non-existent. She is not remotely unsound; but she is easily aroused, escalates quickly and has a hard time getting back under threshhold; and she can be a little skittish about certain things.

I should probably make the disclosure that I think the whole "perfect temperment" thing is bullshit. Just my opinion...but I am of the belief that there is so much individual variablity between dogs; that this "cookie cutter" temperment is a fallacy.

Of course maybe my opinion is driven by the fact that I can't imagine wanting a "cookie cutter perfect dog"...sounds like a dud with no personality to me.

Anyway, I got way off topic on my little rant...

I think all canine behavior has to be taken in the context in which it occurs. I didn't respond to the original post because I honestly thought..."Hmmm...I don't know the dog. I don't know the OP. I don't know what kind of training the dog has had. I can't observe these episodes of barking the OP is talking about. I know nothing about the dog's general behavior, life expereince, typical routine, level of socialization, etc."...basically I don't know enough to really give any sort of significant opinion.

I know there is such a thing as being too close to a situation and losing objectivity; but I also kind of think that when something is really wrong...you feel it in your gut. I try very hard not to let strangers make me second guess my gut.

[bF8CCmmr]

See, we live on a cul-de-sac. Its like living in a fish bowl. NOTHING ever hapens on my block that everyone else doesn't know about. Same people every day, same routine. Rita just barks at people who aren't part of the regular routine if she happens to be looking out the window or is out in the yard.

My gut says she is just alerting us to the fact that something unusual is going on and that she is fine, but never hurts to get another opinion.

[tweriaroats]

Jazzy-- I really liked you post and I agree with it completely. Dogs are dogs. There is a continuum of behavior. Alarm barking is not "human aggression." Last night a man stood by my van and stared at my crated dogs. They ignored him for about 30 seconds. Then they barked. He made a comment about my mean dogs. I told them to be quiet and they were. The guy was creepy and he was acting weird by standing there and staring at them. I knew they would bark if he didn't move on. No surprise, no bad temperaments. Even pit bulls get to be dogs. They do NOT get to be biters.

There is a world of difference between alert/alarm barking and targeted barking where the dog is focused on someone and challenging them. That is a very serious temperament flaw and it needs to be taken very, very seriously. Targeted barking is a bite that just hasn't happened yet and needs to be treated as such.

It's easy to read some behaviors wrong.

---------- Post added at 08:39 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:39 AM ----------

Getting an experienced person's opinion is almost always worth it.

[VINPELA]

Good thread. I was actually going to start one about it today too, mine's a little different so I'll do that still. Puck has mellowed out but he does still bark at new things. He has the exact same bark for a new thing 'person' walking by as he does for a new thing 'item' that I put on my floor just to get him to check out that items can appear and disappear and they are not scary. It's sort of a grunt/bark/choking/hairball noise.

I've never heard anything like it and he only does it at a new thing. The other day I put an empty paper soda box on the kitchen floor and he approached it and umphed at it, circled it umphing, I moved it he umphed and after a while he got up the courage to touch it with his nose and I treated and let him play some tug and then moved on to something else, I think a cup, then a pillow, then a flashlight, etc. This is all stuff I've been doing since he was tiny but I continue it with new stuff a few times a week.

Today I noticed he made the same umph at a couple walking by before he went to the end of his leash wagging his whole body sideways trying to love them up which made me think about it and what he must be thinking. I think he definitely is a little uncertain of new things but he's a pup still and I do think that with the work I've put in over the past few weeks he has stopped the crazy barking he did at three or four people and just began umphing to let me know there is a thing that wasn't there.

I also think any dog should be allowed to bark at things that don't belong as long as that bark doesn't turn into a snarl, or a lunge with teeth. I know I over react when it comes to puppies showing instability and especially with bull dog breeds because of the brainwashing I've received and thinking they need to be the perfect ambassador. Well they aren't ambassadors, they are dogs...

[gusecrync]

OP - Just my 2 cents, but barking at strangers through a window (home territory) and barking at random people walking by when you're out and about are a little different. I can only speak from my experience and ideas, but I've noticed my dog barking a few times off the balcony and told him to cut it out every time. If you let her know it's not acceptable it should have some effect on her behavior.

Maybe the subject of the other thread needs a bit more positive reinforcement when it comes to strangers. Probably isn't too serious but personally I don't allow my dogs to bark at anyone unless there's some kind of threat.

[bF8CCmmr]

Mag, Ike was kind of like that as a pup. He never has barked to let me know something changed and there is a thing there that wasn't before, but he has a kind of chuffing/urrmphing bark he used to use outside last spring.

I got Ike in the winter, so there was a lot he wasn't exposed to since we get so much cold and snow. Come spring he was about 6 months old and started seeing a lot of new stuff like lawnmowers and trash cans and trash can lids. He was definately uncertain of these things and even wouldn't go into the garage because it being open was a whole new thing for him. Didn't take but a couple months and he got over it. I didn't try to make him accept the new stuff, I just went about my business using these new items and he got the point that they weren't bad. Took him til last month to go into the garage, though. And then only because it was raining and the garage is dry. But he goes in there on his own all the time now.

[VINPELA]

Yeah I don't force him to check the stuff out I just put it on the floor in the kitchen usually and do dishes (treats at the ready) while he piddles around or somewhere in the hallway or outside where I know he will see it. He always ends up making friends with the item and usually pulling it around for a while or throwing it in the air if it's small enough.

[ArraryTauTDew]

Hmmm...I'm worried about my dog now...When I got her, she was pretty quiet, but was being shipped around a lot, rescues, my moms house, my house...I've had her for about 6 mos now at my new house...and something has developed probably due to my ignorance. (thought she was just being a dog) She barks with hackles raised at people or dogs in their yard...passing by etc. three weeks ago, I started re-calling her and putting her in a down stay every time she barked, and it has gotten better...so far, so good.

She has leash aggression...worked and worked on this, and finally she ignores most dogs...a very persistent chihuahua followed us off leash nipping at our heels for two blocks yesterday and she ignored. So far, so good.

Point is...I new she has some levels of different kind of aggression...leash, other dominant dogs, my property etc. Which I am taking multiple strides to correct which is working.

Problem: She is a rescue dog, been abused (blah blah same story as you've heard 100 x)...She loves most men...She has a problem with my cousins husband, landlord(great), and another guy...They all have that macho "me be big man" personality. Could this be a trigger? Hackles are up...shes looking between me and them hyper bark...my landlord put his fingers through and she mouthed him a bit...no bite...At first, I was surprised....then immediately in all cases re-called her, put her in a down stay etc. Thankfully my landlord is understanding and worked with her...putting her in down stays and feeding her treats until she was more comfortable...

Scary temperament...I think so...

Is she fully HA? Or, does she have a trigger? I don't know...I have had lessons with a reputable trainer back in the cities ( i live 3 hrs away) planned and I know all will tell me, he will be able to tell me, but I guess, someone would tell me...

"Yes that can happen, and you probably let a behavior go too long and it escalated, but no worries, your dog won't bite someone as long as you correct it now, and work on it."

Side note: she is growly etc...with me with bones/any raw food, but not kibble...She used to be when I cut her nails, but now is relaxed.

---------- Post added at 12:11 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:08 PM ----------

My biggest fear is being an idiot owner...I know I've made some mistakes, but I want to make sure I'm not making ones that could hurt my dog i.e. animal control...

[hHwJ229h]

Lucy barks at people going by our house when she's in the yard, and she'll bark at people when she sees them out the window. She mostly does this when my other dogs are outside (mostly Ethel, she's always the one who starts barking when people are about a block away from my house, and doesn't stop until told or until she can't hear or see them anymore).

If she's in my room, and it's just me and her (or me and Richie are sleeping) and she hears a unusual sound, she'll perk up and growl very softly until she's told to stop. If she really doesn't like the unusual sound she'll growl then bark.

Once she started barking at my friend Bert when he came over. She stopped when I told her to. I thought about it for awhile, and realized she isn't used to big, mountain like men, she's used to tall skinny men, and men of average heights. She doesn't bark at Bert anymore BTW, she realized he needed lots of kisses.

Am I worried? Not really. She loves people. She's great on a leash, never barks or growls, and is always happy to see other people. New objects, and most new people don't really even phase her. I do get the occasional weirdo who she wants nothing to do with, which means I want nothing to do with them.

She never used to bark until Ethel got bigger and decided that because she's big and loud, she needs to inform me of everything going on. Once Ethel started barking at people, Lucy did.

I think sometimes it's a learned behavior. But I don't have a problem with it because I'd rather have warning of something going on outside out of the ordinary, than to have my car broken into (which Lucy has prevented by barking at night a few times, which made me go check outside, and someone was trying to break into my car), or have something worse happen.



Also, I was told by my friend's dad who's had APBTs for 20 years that Lucy's the noisiest APBT he's ever met (this was after he heard her going off at a deer that passed by the kennel, and then kept barking at the woods after it left).

[Opislossy]

Piper hasn't barked at anyone on walks for the last couple weeks. I've been working stopping the behavior just because she looks mean when she does it even if the hair on her back isn't raised.

Now she still barks in the house and I let her do it. If it's just a couple barks as someone walks by I think it's ok. If it goes on for more then a 10 or 20 seconds I make her stop. Now when the mail man goes by that's a 5 minute bark session because all the dogs on the block get involved in it.

[gusecrync]

^^^ You do have the power to stop this 5 minute barking nonsense. Really if she's barking at people on walks too I would not let her bark at anyone for no reason, on your property or not. If she is part shepherd, which she looks to be, this barking is a warning to stay away. It's up to you as "leader" to take over the role of guardian, it's not her job. Now this could be considered dog psychology mumbo jumbo, but the fact is it could eventually lead to really a bad situation.

mjnagel - Sounds like your dog is having a fear based reaction and her trigger is dominant acting men. She most likely perceives this as threatening, aggressive behavior for whatever reason. She needs confidence building and very careful monitoring around guys like this. Ask them to help you out with overcoming this if they're willing. I'd get a muzzle and condition her to wearing it first of all. After she's comfortable with it put her on leash and have one of the guys she's scared of come over with some tasty chopped cooked chicken livers. They need to act a bit more subdued than usual and really make an effort to appear non threatening. She'll probably go apeshit like normal so don't force anything, but do have control of the leash. Let her calm down and have the guy offer her some chicken, maybe by placing it on the ground in front of her if she won't actually approach him. Continue with this until she's comfortable and secure that nothing bad is going to happen. Try to get to the point where she'll take food directly from him and allow physical contact, it will probably take a few sessions until she's more or less relaxed. Be sure to keep the muzzle on until she shows no signs of nervousness. Worth a shot at least.

[Phassetus]

My dog barks at noices outside. he is 6 months and when he hears something outside he barks and his hackles raise. I thought that most dogs when they bark and are unsure of the noise there hackles will raise. Isn't that normal for most dogs?

[ArraryTauTDew]

Ok that makes me feel much better nico, thanks...I did some more research and thats what I found as well...The Shutzhound (sp?) site somebody mentioned on a different thread made it sound like she might have a high defense drive seeing as she is a shepherd pit mix this makes sense...

Looks like I am ahead of the game as well...She makes no move to bite just moves back and forth...my landlord can had feed her and after about 5 min. she will down stay reliably at the fence...

Would you attribute the same reason for behavior at the fence...defense kickin in gear there? Its the same behavior...I have taken to doing the "caesar millan thing" and I stand between her and fence and put in a down stay...also with passerbys out my window...Marked improvement...

Again...this is much appreciated...first hand knowledge always better than my books.