[seekfrieddy]

Animal Advocates in Uproar Over Doggie Style Pet Store | News and Opinion | Philadelphia Weekly

I am torn with this one....I rescued my dog from down south because I instantly fell in love with her picture (she is a pit bull)...I think that it is great that at least one dog is being saved no matter where they are from. However, I can see how some can be angry due to the overwhelming amount of dogs that are put down in Philly...I dont know much of the backstory of Doggie Style that this article is referring to...I will have to do some research...

[sharpyure]

I think it's ridiculous. It's obvious that some people just don't like the owner of Doggie Style (maybe for good reasons, I have no idea and don't care).

The overwhelming majority of rescue dogs in Philadelphia are pit bulls or mostly pit bulls -- yes, there are some exceptions but when they talk about "all the dogs who need homes" that is what they are talking about -- especially since breed-specific rescues siphon off most of the other kinds. They may be nice enough dogs but they aren't for everyone -- I personally feel they are not good city dogs, they need tons of exercise and don't like being inside.

So this other organization brings up smaller breed-specific rescue dogs from the south and the nutty dog people go crazy because people who want fluffly little Bichons (which by the way are very good city dogs) should apparently be forced to adopt pitbulls until there are no pitbulls needing homes in all of Philadelphia. These people are insane.

[jackie Obrian]

Well, took 69 posts...but it happened:

“If you think Ira is a good and savvy business man, you must really be into Hitler as well. Because this bag of crap is an animal killer leading a pet holocaust.”

[Rememavotscam]

There are other area rescues who also bring dogs up from the south without criticism, but I think the controversy over Operation Ava is because it was alleged that they were selling puppy mill dogs when they first started the rescue and have possibly been making a profit.
I don't know anymore than what I've heard over the past couple years, but I know the issue people had was not originally about bring dogs in from other areas, or not promoting pit bulls from our area, but about the owners possibly profiting instead of actually rescuing.

[tipoketpu]

Animal Advocates in Uproar Over Doggie Style Pet Store | News and Opinion | Philadelphia Weekly

I am torn with this one....I rescued my dog from down south because I instantly fell in love with her picture (she is a pit bull)...I think that it is great that at least one dog is being saved no matter where they are from. However, I can see how some can be angry due to the overwhelming amount of dogs that are put down in Philly...I dont know much of the backstory of Doggie Style that this article is referring to...I will have to do some research...

I have mixed feelings for the same reason. Any time a dog's life can be saved is a good thing, no matter where they are located.

[JOR4qxYH]

Well, took 69 posts...but it happened:

“If you think Ira is a good and savvy business man, you must really be into Hitler as well. Because this bag of crap is an animal killer leading a pet holocaust.”

OHHHHHH and we have a winner!!!!

It is true that the employees there are paid VERY little and customers are charged a huge amount. Also the interest is to make money at the expense of the animals. The horrid "grooming" that goes on there is enough to prove that. I had high hopes for them when they opened but they do not have the dog's best interest at heart, nor their employees or consumers. Just the almighty dollar. In this case the products are living beings.

If they wanted to rescue and assist the city, all they would need do is take dogs from ACCT to their shelter and find homes for them. But that would not make them that much money. Hence the bottom line. If you bring in dogs from a shelter at least you aren't getting them from a puppy mill but you do make some money.

In no way does this "shelter" serve the city, actually it goes against the things that people are working so hard to accomplish here. It really IS that bad in Philly. If you drop your pet off at a shelter you can pretty much bet that, unless they are lucky, the poor thing will be put down. It's bad.

Again, if Doggy Style wanted to rescue animals they would take the dogs from ACCT, put them in the large space the have and find homes for them. That would be service. This is, unfortunately, profit. Which is the only thing Doggy Style is about.

[carfAball]

Animal Advocates in Uproar Over Doggie Style Pet Store | News and Opinion | Philadelphia Weekly

I am torn with this one....I rescued my dog from down south because I instantly fell in love with her picture (she is a pit bull)...I think that it is great that at least one dog is being saved no matter where they are from. However, I can see how some can be angry due to the overwhelming amount of dogs that are put down in Philly...I dont know much of the backstory of Doggie Style that this article is referring to...I will have to do some research...

If the shelter down south took larger dogs to meet their demand, as a trade off, no one would have no problem with it. There are rescuers who transport smaller dogs from california all the way to the east coast cities because city dwellers over all want smaller dogs and they are not given up as readily on the east coast. Sometimes larger dogs are transported elsewhere but I don't know with what frequency. I hear about more smaller dogs traveling, unless its a specific rescue.

[diseeKeythilt]

If the shelter down south took larger dogs to meet their demand, as a trade off, no one would have no problem with it. There are rescuers who transport smaller dogs from california all the way to the east coast cities because city dwellers over all want smaller dogs and they are not given up as readily on the east coast. Sometimes larger dogs are transported elsewhere but I don't know with what frequency. I hear about more smaller dogs traveling, unless its a specific rescue.

I guess, i don't know enough about the issue or about the owners of DS, and i certainly applaud what PAWS (where we buy our cat's food and always leave a few extra bucks when we do) and the PSPCA do on a day to day basis, but I don't think I get the vitriol.

In the next couple of years, I will likely be in the market for a dog (we currently have an old shelter cat who hates other animals). I don't want a pit bull. I know, they are great, have a bad rap, etc. and i have known some sweet pit bulls, but I don't want one. I don't think that makes me a bad person. So my choices are either try and get one of the very few non-pitts that are available for adoption, or get a dog from a reputable breeder, or not get a dog at all.

So I guess the question is, in my situation, how is getting an unwanted dog from the South a bad thing? Obviously if they are just enabling puppy mills that's bad. But isn't any unwanted pup an unwanted pup? There are more unwanted animals than people who want them, so isn't it worth trying to increase the number of adopters (i.e. people who won't adopt at all if there only choice is a pitt bull or an older dog, which is a lot of people) by increasing the availability of the high demand dogs?

[MyOwnStyle]

I guess, i don't know enough about the issue or about the owners of DS, and i certainly applaud what PAWS (where we buy our cat's food and always leave a few extra bucks when we do) and the PSPCA do on a day to day basis, but I don't think I get the vitriol.

In the next couple of years, I will likely be in the market for a dog (we currently have an old shelter cat who hates other animals). I don't want a pit bull. I know, they are great, have a bad rap, etc. and i have known some sweet pit bulls, but I don't want one. I don't think that makes me a bad person. So my choices are either try and get one of the very few non-pitts that are available for adoption, or get a dog from a reputable breeder, or not get a dog at all.

So I guess the question is, in my situation, how is getting an unwanted dog from the South a bad thing? Obviously if they are just enabling puppy mills that's bad. But isn't any unwanted pup an unwanted pup? There are more unwanted animals than people who want them, so isn't it worth trying to increase the number of adopters (i.e. people who won't adopt at all if there only choice is a pitt bull or an older dog, which is a lot of people) by increasing the availability of the high demand dogs?

Like someone else mentioned above, there are breed rescues for basically every breed out there from shi tzus to Great Danes though, so you really don't have to settle for a pittie from the shelter or a breeder for tons of money or support a puppy mill. The breed rescues work with rescues from other parts of the country, so you might be adopting a dog that isn't from this area. Which is fine of course. An unwanted bishon from Richmond, VA has as much of a right to find a family as an unwanted pitbull from Port Richmond. But breed rescues are still rescues. The uproar over Operation Ava seems to be that the owners might not be rescuing dogs and adopting them out, but profiting off of dogs.

[Goodwin]

In the next couple of years, I will likely be in the market for a dog (we currently have an old shelter cat who hates other animals). I don't want a pit bull. I know, they are great, have a bad rap, etc. and i have known some sweet pit bulls, but I don't want one. I don't think that makes me a bad person. So my choices are either try and get one of the very few non-pitts that are available for adoption, or get a dog from a reputable breeder, or not get a dog at all.So I guess the question is, in my situation, how is getting an unwanted dog from the South a bad thing? Obviously if they are just enabling puppy mills that's bad. But isn't any unwanted pup an unwanted pup? There are more unwanted animals than people who want them, so isn't it worth trying to increase the number of adopters (i.e. people who won't adopt at all if there only choice is a pitt bull or an older dog, which is a lot of people) by increasing the availability of the high demand dogs?

...Or go to Petfinder.com and search for the type of dog you are looking for. There are a zillion rescues that have dogs for adoption so I'm sure you will find something. And no it is not a bad thing rescuing a dog from the south. As long as you are saving a life and not contributing to the horrendous puppy mill industry then it is a good thing. But there seems to be more to the story with this particular organization.

[juspimoubbodo]

I agree with going on petfinder to find a dog or searching for a specfic rescue group...there are sooo many: french bulldogs, great danes, vizslas, etc. I went on Petfinder to find my dog and she was listed as a dogo argentino pit bull mix (I wanted a dogo argentino)...well 2 years later she is 45 pounds full grown so she is def just a pit! But I love her all the same!

I guess my question is where is/was Doggie Style getting their dogs from that made people think it was from a puppy mill?

I know that if you purchase a dog from the pet store or internet that it is highly likely that the dog is from a puppy mill...what advice would you give to someone going to rescue a dog so you know that you are not supporting a puppy mill? I would have adopted from Operation Ava if I did not see this article so if it is not out in the open, how would one know?!

Gladys good point with if they wanted to help the rescues in Phila that they would take some of the dogs out of PAWS or ACCT.

It sickens me to think they would support puppy mills and I have purchased toys from them before....never again!!!

Someone said that PAWS sells dog food....does anyone know if they sell Rx dog food?

[legal-advicer]

I would have adopted from Operation Ava if I did not see this article so if it is not out in the open, how would one know?! but the article says they are NOT getting them from puppy mills so what is the problem?

it seems like at some point they were rumored to be taking puppy mill "rejects" -- I don't know what happens to those dogs if they are not "rescued" so what the difference is I have no idea, but in any case they are not doing that now.

Gladys good point with if they wanted to help the rescues in Phila that they would take some of the dogs out of PAWS or ACCT. you would really recommend putting a pit bull in the window of a retail establishment? that just seems ridiculous to me, not to mention cruel to the dog. it's not so great for the smaller dogs but its more appropriate and my guess is they are being adopted quickly. and as we said, PAWS and ACCT are really limited in the smaller dogs they offer.

I don't know anything about the DS owners but this seems like a dumb argument.

as for breed-specific rescues, they are great, but they are also small and run by people who are sometimes not so efficient. I am dealing with one now and they are not exactly the easiest people to work with, although I have no doubt that they love their dogs and take good care of them, but getting them to return a phone call is like pulling teeth. If I saw a rescue doggie in a window that was the breed I wanted today and he/she was ready to be adopted I don't see why some activist should interfere with that choice because the process isn't "pure" enough for them.

[Trikaduliana]

I do believe that Operation Ava does pull a few dogs from ACCT now since they've opened their site in No Libs, but it sounds like the bulk are from down south. As the article states, the PSPCA had investigated the dogs they had for adoption in their stores in the past, which were rumored to be from mills. I know that they do have ex -PSPCA employees who are now operating the rescue, so hopefully things have changed for the better. But because of all the past allegations people are skeptical of their practices now.
Anyone looking to adopt from rescues should look for ones that have 501 c3 status and doing a quick google search will turn up any organizations that are questionable. Also, most of the local rescues know each other and a lot of the volunteers/workers from ACCT and PAWS can vouch for the reputable organizations in the area. Most would be happy to refer good adopters to a rescue that has a dog you are looking for if one of the shelters doesn't already have a good fit for you.

[Si8jy8HN]

I guess, i don't know enough about the issue or about the owners of DS, and i certainly applaud what PAWS (where we buy our cat's food and always leave a few extra bucks when we do) and the PSPCA do on a day to day basis, but I don't think I get the vitriol.

In the next couple of years, I will likely be in the market for a dog (we currently have an old shelter cat who hates other animals). I don't want a pit bull. I know, they are great, have a bad rap, etc. and i have known some sweet pit bulls, but I don't want one. I don't think that makes me a bad person. So my choices are either try and get one of the very few non-pitts that are available for adoption, or get a dog from a reputable breeder, or not get a dog at all.

So I guess the question is, in my situation, how is getting an unwanted dog from the South a bad thing? Obviously if they are just enabling puppy mills that's bad. But isn't any unwanted pup an unwanted pup? There are more unwanted animals than people who want them, so isn't it worth trying to increase the number of adopters (i.e. people who won't adopt at all if there only choice is a pitt bull or an older dog, which is a lot of people) by increasing the availability of the high demand dogs?

It's not a bad thing. You would be better off going to a breed specific rescue, there are many around here and around the country. When getting a dog it is best to know who you are and what the breed characteristics are. Even if you get a mixed breed you can usually guess as to the temperament. e.g. terriers are wonderful dogs but are called terrors for a good reason. They are independent, very energetic and require an owner to really stay on top of the training or they will walk all over them. Are you energetic, willing to get the dog daily exercise, do you mind barking.. etc. When i was looking for a dog i took this quiz, it was very helpful.

Animal Planet :: Guides :: Dog Breed Selector

Gave me a list of the top dogs that matched my lifestyle and i ended up with a dog around #9. It has been a very good match. It took me a year asking the breeder questions and them asking me and i felt they were reputable. Choosing a breeder is important, you need to be asking a lot of questions and if you can go visit the mother and place the breeder uses. The breeder should be asking as many questions of you as you do of them.

I would be the wrong person to have a pitt bull. Neither of us would be happy and no it does not make anyone a bad person not getting one. The point with this shelter is it bills itself as a rescue and there are so many dogs here to be rescued. If the chain used it's stores to advertise whatever dogs they pull from ACCT they could place a lot of dogs regardless of breed. The fact that they import fluffy little dogs (i have two by the way) indicates the priority is to make a buck. that coupled with this chain's practices in other areas is cause for concern. Rescuing a dog from anywhere is a great thing. People drive dogs to homes all over the country. that's not really the issue. I guess it is that as part of the community the "shelter" they have built is large and could accomodate and do a lot but by not using the dogs that are here and being tiny breed specific. It shows get low sell high... does that make sense?

If a scotty dog was right for you and you found one in say, florida that was in a shelter - go for it! Couldn't be a better thing to do.

Does that answer your question?

P.s. Some breed specific rescues can be a real pain in the ass. Ask you everything but your blood type and want to inspect your house. I tried to rescue a dog in the breed appropriate to me for two years with out luck. No one would let me have any dog.. even a tiny lap dog, without a back yard. CRAZY! That question came up and the phone went down. Start with pet finder and you will see dogs from all over the country or come on here and someone will help. I like "Chic Petique" in Northern liberties, they rescue cats and dogs. the owner lindsay is very knowledgable and could point you in the right direction. (she started her store because her dog was dying and the vet said there was no hope. She changed his diet and the dog lived. She wanted to educate people on dog food and care. And while her business is successful, its not out to profit off of the dogs without caring for them. Does that make sense.)

[Indidockobeni]

you would really recommend putting a pit bull in the window of a retail establishment? that just seems ridiculous to me, not to mention cruel to the dog. it's not so great for the smaller dogs but its more appropriate and my guess is they are being adopted quickly. and as we said, PAWS and ACCT are really limited in the smaller dogs they offer.

i wouldn't recommend any dog be put in a store window, ever.

[LOVEBoy]

as for breed-specific rescues, they are great, but they are also small and run by people who are sometimes not so efficient. I am dealing with one now and they are not exactly the easiest people to work with, although I have no doubt that they love their dogs and take good care of them, but getting them to return a phone call is like pulling teeth. If I saw a rescue doggie in a window that was the breed I wanted today and he/she was ready to be adopted I don't see why some activist should interfere with that choice because the process isn't "pure" enough for them.

What type of dog are you looking for? There are several small breed dogs at ACCT right now. Check the dog bust thread in the south philly section. Someone posted a few on there and new dogs come in everyday. I agree some rescues can be difficult to deal. They are run by volunteers, (many who have full time jobs and families) and some have strict application processes, but if you are a good candidate and patient, you should be able to find a dog. Good luck and I hope it doesn't deter you from adopting!
As for the criticism of DS, it has nothing to do with interfering with your choice of dog. It has to do with supporting an industry that profits off of animal cruelty and then in turn making more profit for their company under the guise of rescuing.

[AXGreg]

I see no problem whatsoever with rescuing an animal from the South rather than from here. It was still in need of a home. The dog is just happy that it has a home. A life was saved -- that's what's important.

Another issue people seem to have with Doggie Style (and ONLY DS) is the adoption fee that they charge. Second Time Around, Home At Last, and Adopt a Boxer (to name just three) all have adoption fees of approximately $200 to $300 -- yet when DS charges $300, they're "masquerading" as a non-profit.

I'm not saying I'm pro-Operation Ava, and I've never shopped at Doggie Style. I just have a problem with some of the arguments against DS.

[BigBobdd]

I see no problem whatsoever with rescuing an animal from the South rather than from here. It was still in need of a home. The dog is just happy that it has a home. A life was saved -- that's what's important.

Another issue people seem to have with Doggie Style (and ONLY DS) is the adoption fee that they charge. Second Time Around, Home At Last, and Adopt a Boxer (to name just three) all have adoption fees of approximately $200 to $300 -- yet when DS charges $300, they're "masquerading" as a non-profit.

I'm not saying I'm pro-Operation Ava, and I've never shopped at Doggie Style. I just have a problem with some of the arguments against DS.

my feelings exactly.

if they are "importing fluffy little dogs" who need rescuing because they are popular city dogs and are more likely to find a home here than say, in the rural south where they may want a dog who hunts and runs around outdoors, what exactly is the problem with that?

their adoption fees are exactly the same as any of the breed-specific rescues I've dealt with. so the "make a buck" argument doesn't really fly here.

as for the window, I don't like it myself, but if a dog more likely to find a home by spending a few days hanging out in a window play area in Rittenhouse Square than months in a cage in Hunting Park I can see the cost/benefit working out for the dog.

[Ornamiviant]

I do not really care if Doggie Style is making a profit as long as what they do results in more homeless dogs getting adopted. If the net benefit to society is positive, then who cares. I disagree with Garret Elwood's statement in the article that a dog adopted through Operation Ava equals a dog in Philadelphia not getting adopted. There are some people out there who are not going to adopt a pitbull no matter what those of us who love the "breed" do or say. If someone wants a Pomeranian, for example, and is going to buy one anyway, I'd rather it be one from a shelter in the south, than a dog from a backyard breeder or puppy mill.

[StarsWorld]

as for the window, I don't like it myself, but if a dog more likely to find a home by spending a few days hanging out in a window play area in Rittenhouse Square than months in a cage in Hunting Park I can see the cost/benefit working out for the dog.

PAWS has dogs and cats displayed in windows at their adoption center at 2nd and Arch. And if that spurs people to come in and look around -- great!